About this blog

Untypical Boro is a lively topical blog by the Evening Gazette's award winning football columnist Anthony Vickers that aims to get behind the headlines to flesh out the stories that Boro fans are talking about.

Incisive, provocative and well informed it seeks to engage with articulate supporters and give them a platform to help set the agenda on the issues that matter.

Recent comments

Recent Posts

Sponsored links

Archives

Links

Advertiser

Sponsored links


Downing Dream Should Still Be At Boro

Posted by on January 15, 2008 2:00 PM | 

STEWIE Downing should be wary of think Spurs is a dream move. It he goes - and we must hope he does not - it could quickly turn into a nightmare for him, especially if he thinks that in leaving the Riverside he will escape the attentions of the boo-boys. There are plenty of those seething with decades of frustration and stung by the success of their rivals at London's answer to Newcastle and they won't give him much time to deliver before the cat-calls start.

On Teesside Downing does get plenty of unfair stick, there is no doubt about that. There has always been a chickenrun mentality within the Boro crowd, an vocal minority for whom being top scorer, assist king and the first local lad still playing for the club to run out in a World Cup for a generation is just not enough; those who will not be happy that he is really playing for the shirt until he runs back the full length of the pitch and breaks his leg in a 30/70 tackle; those who are proud of their parochialism and who who see it as their sacred duty to ensure home grown heroes do not harbour any Fancy Dan ideas above their station.

But he also gets fantastic support. He is idolised by large sections of the crowd and the wider community who recognise that not only is he a great talent but also that he is a symbol of the unity between the raggy-arsed lads on the working class estates of Teesside and the ones who wear the shirt on the pitch. Teessiders in the team are a visible demonstration that Boro is our team, a representation of our hopes and desires and a burning pride in our town, our accent, our heritage being played out on the pitch.

He is not praised just because he is from Pallister Park though. It is because he is a genuine talent, a creative force and a potent force that has contributed to the team holding its own on the biggest stage. His arrival as a prodigious youngster was massively important because he provided a spark or entertainment just as the Steve McClaren's cold cloak of scientific professionalism was starting to stifle the team. He brought flashes of sponteniety and excitement and was in the vanguard of the Academy production line that brought hope for a bright new future of Boro born stars as the spine of the squad.

He has also been indulged because of that. When he has had dips in form, dropped the odd blob or gone off the boil he has been backed by the fans and the local media, partly because he was still developing and partly because he was one of ours. He will not get that at Spurs.

If he goes to Spurs it will be as an established star with high expectations and very little time to prove himself. He will also go with an image that has been created by a jaundiced national media who saw him as a handy proxy England scapegoat on the entirely understandable grounds that he played for the same club that McClaren used to manage.

At Boro he is a star because we have watched as he tore teams apart, delivered a string of deadly balls on a plate for Hasselbaink, Viduka, Yakubu and on some glorious Euro-nights for Massimo Maccarone to see off Basel and Steaua. Massimo took the plaudits but it was Stewie who carved out the chances and helped create history for Boro.

At Spurs he will be the no-mark from a team of provincial strugglers, the England flop who was booed off and vilified and hung out to dry by a malicious media who would prefer a wrong footed show pony from a glamour club to play in his place. And the Spurs snipers will be waiting for him to put his first stray cross into the crowd so they can slaughter him. That's how it works. Football is not fair. The Spurs fans message boards have already passed judgement: 'Donkey Downing' and 'a poor man's Darren Anderton' are just two of the comments.

I am not one of those who thinks leaving is a capital offence, far from it. But if Downing does go he can do far better than Spurs. And he can strength his position and his image before he goes by extending his stay at the Riverside long enough to show exactly what he can do. Let's see him ping those crosses in for Mido, Alves, Fred and Tuncay and be hailed as the creative genius at the heart of a new look attacking Boro. Let's see him win over the Boro boo-boys, have the Spurs fans choking on their humble pie and have really big clubs queuing up for him.

Comments (87)

John Dobey wrote...

I couldn't agree more, Stewart Downing is far to good for a club like Spurs. In my view it is in everybody's interests for him to stay, if we attract one of the mooted targets Stewart will be able to see the future at Boro, if not what he is looking for a move to a far more ambitious club than spurs.

Posted by: John Dobey  | January 15, 2008 3:22 PM

Werdermouth wrote...

AV, I think you've just sealed the case for not selling Downing.

If we manage to buy 1 or 2 top class strikers then his delivery will have an end product - and hence his Opta stats will go through the roof.

This means come the summer he will either be able to justify a £15m transfer fee OR will be more than happy to play in a sucessful Boro side capable of challenging for a top 6 spot again.

Posted by: Werdermouth  | January 15, 2008 3:29 PM

Smoggy Paul wrote...

Spot on Mr V, as usual. I live down in Sussex and have also spent my time in London and have been round all the London clubs. There will be no loving honeymoon period for an unloved Northerner from an unfashionable North East.

The fans don't really want him, there is no guarantee that the manager does either, or that he will even be the manager this time next year.

At some point, Stewy should move on and try something new, but not now, not while Boro are strengthening, and certainly not to Totteringham! The Geordie similarity is apt - it's all about history, not about the present!!

Stewy, stay son, we love you, and help Fred and Alf to 40 goals!!!!!

Posted by: Smoggy Paul  | January 15, 2008 4:03 PM

Colin wrote...

Hit the nail bang on the head. "Wrong footed show pony from a glamour club" - Joe Cole to me and you !

Downing will inevitably leave for an arguably bigger club, I think he deserves the chance and i hope he does well, But he has to remember that getting to the top is one thing....staying there is another.

Posted by: Colin  | January 15, 2008 4:04 PM

g.dagger wrote...

Exactly. Recent threads on internet messageboards suggest the majority of Spurs fans don't even want him to come. They have bigger names in mind: more foreigners but they don't care about that do they.

Downing must realise that he is worth a lot more to us than anyone else.

If he thinks the fans got to him at the Riverside the other month, the pressure he'll be under at Spurs will make him feel like he is standing on the surface of Jupiter.

Posted by: g.dagger  | January 15, 2008 4:53 PM

'Ignorant' of boroland wrote...

Stewart Downing ,I hope you read AV's words as they are not agent banter , they are very true.

Anyway you are too good for Spurs and we may have better fire power than them soon.

Posted by: 'Ignorant' of boroland  | January 15, 2008 4:54 PM

Ian Gill wrote...

I personally think he has the talent to do well at Spurs because they have mobile strikers to exploit his skills. The key thing would be if Ramos wants him or he is a purchase by Comoli foisted upon him.

But I think he would do better staying where he is, always have done. For all his faults he is our best player. The press hyenas picked on him to roger MacClaren. After the Macedonia game he got the blame when 4 out of Englands 5 chances were made by him.

Gerrard played wide right and often appeared on the left of Ashley Cole and Downing cramping space and dragging all the defenders across.

Enough of the rant, it is largely up to Stewie, never mind the press, he was getting slaughtered on our message boards as well.

He is no dummy and he and his family know what was and is still being said. At least if the southerners are having a go it wont be his own folk doing it to one of their own.

Posted by: Ian Gill  | January 15, 2008 5:07 PM

Fea wrote...

I agree Stewy is fast becoming the best left sided midfielder in the country, is work rate is much better he covers his full back well and very rarley puts a pass wide.

Much more than a winger in my book but still capable of carrying out a winger's duties. To many people at the Boro want to see him dribble past his man all the time even in our third of the pitch.

Keep with the Boro Stewy, don't let the numties get you down and as for Spurs "Why be dishonest my dears"

Posted by: Fea  | January 15, 2008 5:15 PM

Richard wrote...

Yeh! Way to go AV!

Excellent and timely choice of blog subject.

And how right you are!

I hope Stewart reads it and takes heed.

And if he requires any convincing of how things often don't go quite so well for Boro leavers who have been held in some regard while here, but supposedly moved on to better things, he need look no further than Zenden, Ziege, Viduka (choke) & Queudrue in recent history.

There are relatively few, (I struggle to think of any really) whom you would say did any better elsewhere - other than perhaps financially.

But as Harry Redknapp and Mark Hughes acknowledged and demonstrated in turning down the Newcastle Manager's job, some things are more important than more money. And whilst it is, of course, flattering for others to take an interest in you, if you're already very well-paid (rich by most people's standards, in fact) and you are held in some esteem by those around you and your employer looks after you, what is there out there that's so much better than what you've got where you are?

I've said it before, a move to Spurs is not moving up a level for anyone at Boro.

As pointed out, a move there and he'd be in danger of losing more than he'd gain when his new Boro contract is negotiated. I feel sure that Boro will offer him a fair and reasonably competitive wage as part of the package.

For his sake and for Boro's, I really do hope he stays, even if Spurs or anyone else eventually make an offer.

Posted by: Richard  | January 15, 2008 5:48 PM

dave w wrote...

As a Boro fan who lives in London I know a few "del boy" opinions of the boro's boy wonder and it isn't "he's the new Giggs". Downing regardless of the odd boo's must know he is looked upon as one of our own "boy done good".

The current transfer activity looks like push for the 1996 feel good atmosphere and he must ask himself does he want to be apart of it. It can quickly go wrong at Spurs , Londons barcodes.

Whose to say 18 months of in and out fluctuating form and the "overpaid northerner" could be on loan at championship bound Fulham playing in front of 10,000 people.

I would love Stewy to stay because he is intrinsic in the football style that Southgate is trying to play. I mean who can forget the Bolton match last year when he destroyed them in the first half. Sit it out and see what the next 6 months hold it could be interesting!!

Posted by: dave w  | January 15, 2008 5:57 PM

David Morrison wrote...

great column AV, however i think im gunna put a case forward as to why his sale would be great for him and the club.

The progression Downing has made has been good, not excellent, but good. he has a sweet left foot and delivery is great, aswell as showing commitment and attacking mentality.

However he has not sparked the team like a WRIGHT PHILLIPS or a Petrov this season.

Yes he has 5 goals and a few assists but look at it overall.
Wright Phillips in 153 appearances before a £21m move to Chelsea 26 goals and many more assists.

Downing 122 appearances 12 goals. ( info off internet so if not entirely accurate apologise) says it all for me. He is a good player but an average one at that until a big club (top 4) take him and improve him allways will be.

He is made up because he is left footed and yes mcclaren gave him his chance. (lets see if cappello does the same in his squads).

The point i am getting at is that Downing is a good Middlesbrough player and to go might be a good chance to get some funds (10-15 million quoted) and give johnson his chance. for me Downing looks flat and only interested when he can try and stand like Beckham for corners or free kicks. No one person is as big as the club and if he and his agent want to think better then let them and see how far they get at Tottenham.

whatever he chooses to stay or go he can lift his head high and have the backing of the boro fans me included.

Posted by: David Morrison  | January 15, 2008 6:00 PM

tonyblack wrote...

I have always thought Downing to be over rated, but that's not say that I don't rate him, far from it. I think he's a very talented player who has still areas that need work on.

For me his weakness lies in that he's a bit short of ability to take people on / lacking confidence in taking people on and that he does seem to go missing quite often in games.

That said, there is no doubt in my mind that he would definately be a great loss to the team, espacially given that I don't think that we will get what he's worth.

Add to that that left sided players of his obvious ability to put in a match winning cross are hard to find, especially not at silly money, and the rational for selling him seems lost on me completely.

Personally I wouldn't sell him unless it really was for money that a club like the Boro just couldn't turn down.

A signal of the clubs intentions and ambitions would be to offer him a bumper deal to keep him here. I do absolutely agree that the fact that he's a local lad makes him more important as an asset to the club for all sorts of reasons.

AV, can I ask you a question ? I have long been a critic of the count. Why has SD contract taken so long to sort out and is this a trend / mistake that has seen us lose other players ?

TB

**AV writes: What is to sort out? He signed a new deal two years ago then his agent began agitating for yet another new improved one almost before the ink was dry. As far as I can see the club are neither dragging their feet nor messing anyone around but quite rightly sticking by a deal that everyone shook hands on.

I have no problem with that. Had the waters not been muddied then the coming summer would be the right time to open preliminary talks on a new deal. The current situation may speed that up or force the club's hand.

Posted by: tonyblack  | January 15, 2008 6:30 PM

Si wrote...

You've said it all, Vic. I hope Stewie reads this and realises what he might - MIGHT - be letting himself in for.

Spurs are indeed the Newcastle of London. For all the things they have that we don't - packed ground, wider fan base, manager with a UEFA Pro Licence - they are living off all those things, not to mention their illustrious history.

Because like Newcastle they aren't very far away from us in the table, aren't they? And that's despite an international strike force!

I am sure in his heart Stewie doesn't really want to go - he still appears as committed as ever - but all I can see right now is Ian Elliott ham-handedly pounding the same old story into the paper again and again to convince Stewie to move. Of course, if people tell him "You're upsetting the fans, not to mention the player." he would say "So what? Think of the amount of cash I'll make from this!"

As I've said before, pathetic. (If he keeps the speculation dragging to the end of the window he may make a lot of money anyway, which is almost as bad.)

If Stewie himself really wants to go, however, that's something else. In that case we should look to see if we can get at least £12 million for him - after all, in his breakthrough season (2004/05) I read in the Star that Arsene Wenger was to splash £10 million on him! (Of course, it was a load of rubbish, but you never know...)

I'm firmly of the belief that if someone doesn't want to stay at a club (or country), no matter how important they are, don't force them. (See: The Yak, Alan Pardew, Walter Smith, Alex McLeish.)

We've also got to look at it another way - while he might be persuaded to commit himself if we do sign Alves, not to mention Fred, do we have enough money to cover these players' transfer fees and wages? Whatever happens, we don't want to end up another Leeds.

Posted by: Si  | January 15, 2008 6:55 PM

Nigel wrote...

All true AV, but surely the issue is does he want to move or not. Are all the rumours being used by his agent as a lever in salary negotiations?

My feeling is that he is happy to stay for the time being at least. He is no fool he can see what is happening at Boro and there is absolutley no guarantee that he will play in a more succesful team at Spurs.

Once Boro have completed the January transfer transactions a new contract for Stewie must be top priority. Then if a top four team want him, he gets to maybe realise an ambition and Boro bank a lot of cash.

As I have posted several times in the past few days he has to be worth 15million at least given the length of his current contract. Boro are under no pressure to sell him.

Posted by: Nigel  | January 15, 2008 7:58 PM

steve h wrote...

I hope Downing reads that.

Gibbo should offer him a pay rise and a long term contract.

In a couple of years one of the big 4 will come in for him, and we'll make a lot more than if we sell him to Spurs now.

Posted by: steve h  | January 15, 2008 8:05 PM

tonyblack wrote...

Cheers AV, I wasn't aware of that.

TB

Posted by: tonyblack  | January 15, 2008 8:27 PM

David Whelpton wrote...

Stewie .. we love you

Ignore the London media and whingeing gets

Fulfill your ambition at The Boro!

Posted by: David Whelpton  | January 15, 2008 9:26 PM

Paul wrote...

As a Spurs fan I am honestly shocked to read these comments!

Downing is simply not an improvement on Malbranque and he is right footed on the left wing! The other point of note is that Gareth Bale is going to be the best left back/wing player for years to come in the premier league as a whole. The guy is simply fantastic.

Spurs fans would welcome any player who puts on our shirt and always try and help any of our players with support so to say we would boo him is simply not true.

But the facts are that Downing would be a squad player for us and for the reported 12 million?! is a pointless rip off. Then again, Spurs do pay over the odds for players we dont need. Aka Darren Bent.

Finally, to suggest Downing could get into a better club than us is strange. Admittedly we are having a truely awful season, but next season I expect to be at least 7th and pushing higher.

Downing would not get into any top 4 side or Man City as they have Petrov. We are the only side left for him but we really dont want him.

Posted by: Paul  | January 15, 2008 9:39 PM

richardw wrote...

spurs have been after downing for over 2 years now and through 2 managers, so is it coincidence that both managers want him or could it be the board?

Posted by: richardw  | January 15, 2008 10:10 PM

Redcar Red wrote...

I think all the Booing/Chicken Run hysteria is massively over hyped. At the time the team were shocking and Downings performances were too! The club as a whole were being booed not just Downing, from the board and coaching staff down to the 11 players on the pitch.

Some of the team displays at the time were ranging from farcical to diabolical including the selection policy. Certain individuals came in for a lot more stick than others, Downing was one but DGL and Schwarzer faced a lot more vitriol at the time. Boateng also faced more than his fair share of heckling.

If anyone claims to have gone through life without a right royal rollocking at some point or other I don't believe them. At the time he needed a good kick up his Londonderry Air (including messr's Lamb & Co) and the subsequent response from him on the pitch (and from others off it.....think PR) proved it had the desired effect. Instead of constantly carping and crying about it take it on the chin and be a man about it and move on, the supporters have!

I will bet when he looks back on his career he will realise it was a defining time for him and will be the making of him rather than the breaking of him. Without it he would have continued in his own cocooned environment and never having been challenged or pushed. A reality check does no one any harm at all.

Rudyard Kipling, a man more learned than most of us on here once wrote: "If you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs and blaming it on you;
If you can trust yourself when all men doubt you,
But make allowance for their doubting too; ...............

then ended it with........

"Yours is the Earth and everything that's in it,
And - which is more - you'll be a Man my son!"

Finally if he thinks the stick he took a while back at the Riverside was OTT then wait until he has a poor run of form at WHL and then abuse will take on a new meaning.

Stewy should stay at the Riverside and be a part of a (hopefully) new dawning rather than becoming the next Bent for the Spuds.

Posted by: Redcar Red  | January 15, 2008 10:35 PM

Ian Oliver wrote...

Take the money, he's not that special, look at the stats!!

Don't bet on the 'Big 4' offering more down-the-line. Kewell and Giggs are well past their sell-by date (in premiership terms) and Chelsea got rid of Duff in favour of a "Wrong footed show pony". I don't hear them knocking at the door when they can get a 'bargain'.

Take off the blinkers, his current 'development' is nothing more than anechdotal. Take advantage of a club still in managerial turmoil following their 'spoonful of Sugar'.

This interest in Downing transcends two managers and is probably being driven by the same forces that brought in Bent for a ridiculous price.

Posted by: Ian Oliver  | January 15, 2008 10:37 PM

Ste Mac wrote...

We shouldnt be thinking in terms of how much Spurs value him but how much he is worth to Boro. How much would it cost to replace him?

Top scorer, most assists, main creative outlet, drops deep to help defend, the man who puts in the crosses who Mido (£6m) and Alves (£14m?) or Fred (£10m?) are supposed to get on the end of. It will cost us far more than £8m to replace what he brings to the team.

Selling him is madness.Johnson is not ready yet. He's shown that since he come back from Watford. Tuncay is a different sort of player. We need Stewy.

We are only one point above relegation. We can't afford to disrupt the team and get rid of the one threat now and hope a new lad slot straight in and scores.

He's on a long contract, make him stay. If we need to balance the books sell Johnson or Woodgate but keep Stewie.

Posted by: Ste Mac  | January 15, 2008 11:11 PM

Neil M wrote...

If Stewie goes then every one of the idiot boo-boys who have screamed at him should be ashamed of what they have done.

It is alright saying they should take it because they earn big bucks to square it with your own conscience but you must be stupid to think he doesn't hear it and it doesn't have an effect.

Why stay here when there are so many Boro whingers who cant bear to see a local lad do well?


Posted by: Neil M  | January 15, 2008 11:18 PM

Mainy wrote...

Ive not posted for a while as have been busy with work, so a few points to catch up on.

Firstly, well done to all the fans who turned out for the liverpool game, you backed the team and on a day when i thought the opportunity for the fans to get slaughtered by the Geordies didnt happen. Im refering to the Mido chants and the fuss that caused. We could have sang the liverpoool slums song but it never happened from what i heard so maybe a lesson was learned.

The other thing about the getting behind the team & stewey downing in particular. I didnt hear any boo's or groans, but for the first time in a while I heard the stewey downing on the wing song!

if we encourage him he will play better and it will prompt him to stay. We need him, what would be the point of signing a forward like alves/fred if you are going to sell your best crosser/ most creative player.

Posted by: Mainy  | January 15, 2008 11:20 PM

chris wrote...

Love it paul has just made downing into a right winger ....not the rare left footed winger in english football....he's worth 50p now is he not? :) funny....i like johnson....15million let him go...if not he is a good local lad keep him.

Posted by: chris  | January 16, 2008 12:32 AM

chris wrote...

I love tottenham......remember when they had chas and dave......now that was a strike force....lol

Posted by: chris  | January 16, 2008 12:36 AM

Philip George wrote...

I for the first time in my life have been gob smacked ,enraged , laughing and stunned.

I can take abuse from the big 4 because they are better , I dont care if in the eyes of the rest of the footballing world Tottenham are perceived as a small club or simply not a big one. That could never question or effect my loyalty.

However there are several things that do get under my skin, one of which is when other clubs who are quite clearly hypocrites , who are talking out of their backside.

You're criticism of Tottenham are not only ironic and moronic given you said that you yourselves have booed your best and only player of merit but the fact that that is the only time you can manage to provoke a reaction from an otherwise tepid crowd with poor attendances that rarely fill your stadium. We fill almost every single league game.

They are ironic given your statement that Downing can do better and that we as spurs fans have decided upon him already, im going to challenge that in 2 stages.

1. If he is too big for us , then he is far too big for Middlesborough

2. Message boards are hardly representative of our fan base given ours is fairly large in comparison to most in the premier league.

By this I mean that the vast, vast , vast minority have made their minds up and really most just hold the price to be rather too large given our record with big money signings such as Bent and Rebrov.

Do I have to mention you have only won the league cup , that Middlesborough's impact on football is minimal at best, that Tottenham have done most things such as the FA cup and league double, winning European trophies before others. We are still the only non-league team to have ever won the FA Cup and been in top divisions decades before you.

One could also find your opinions regarding the south bordering on prejudice. If i was to say things on a similar vein I would be wrong because I'm not into generalizing regions of Britain.

Your attack on our fans was interesting , I recall even during a poor performance vs Getafe huge support for Martin Jol , the fans never once called for his head , that was the boards decision. We don't blame all our failures on one player, I'm sure that when Downing does join he will be given time to settle in , whether he will be successful no one can say but I hope he will be.

Our season has been poor by our standards but we are in Europe, we are in the semi finals of the league cup, we are above you in the league , we finished above you 2 seasons running.

I used to think we were optimistic but your belief in signing Fred too or at least your fans belief is laughable given he will not be playing for middlesborough , I bet my trust fund on that.

Oh and I forgot - the fact he said he wanted to move to Tottenham himself saying it would be better for his career ... I think if everything else has passed you by or been ignored or countered - that one thing proves you to be so utterly utterly wrong. I am appalled you are able to right as a football pundit.

Posted by: Philip George  | January 16, 2008 4:27 AM

Danny wrote...

Alex Ferguson perhaps the all-time greatest Premiership manager ever, has needed cover for Giggs yet didn't come in for Downing. Arsene Wenger, again one of the top managers in the league didn't come in for Downing when Pires or Ljungberg left Arsenal. Liverpool needed a left winger but didn't try for Downing.

I guess what i am trying to say is that many of the top managers don't rate Downing that highly otherwise they would have been sniffing around a long time ago. I personally think he is over-rated and a big fish in a small pond at Boro.

Don't get me wrong, Downing is a good player and a class player on his day but sadly way, way too inconsistant. He needs to start attacking players and running directly at them at every opportunity like Giggs did for Man Utd and Pires did for Arsenal, and Stuart Ripley did for Boro and Blackburn. Strike fear into defenders and have them panic knowing you'll skin them every chance you get.

Stick with the Boro, were going places...whether that is up or down i have no idea!

Posted by: Danny  | January 16, 2008 7:13 AM

Ian Oliver wrote...

“We shouldn’t be thinking in terms of how much Spurs value him but how much he is worth to Boro. How much would it cost to replace him?”

Where was this concern with Viduka and Yakubu? Look at the mess we’re in now!

“Top scorer, most assists, main creative outlet, drops deep to help defend, the man who puts in the crosses”

OH PLEASE!! Use your eyes and look at the stats, he’s a woeful defender, limited speed and no dribbling capability (I’ll spare you the embarrassment of how many poor crosses he puts in).

If all you lot think is ‘crosses win matches’ then heaven help us, look at how many Viduka and Yakubu scored with headers. If all we need is a crosser of the ball, dust-off Mendieta and sink all our money into Crouch.

I’ve seen better and more important players than Downing leave The Boro, but not since David Mills have I seen one so over-rated in price and his alleged value to the team. Cash in, you know it makes sense!

Posted by: Ian Oliver  | January 16, 2008 7:28 AM

robin mitton wrote...

Dear AV, Tony Black and all,

A very significant result against EUROPE'S CAPITAL OF VULTURES! I think in a 'real' relegation situ we'd have been hammered by 3-4 clear goals.

Please watch out for PSG's results as from this Thursday my new life in France with them and NIKE begins. Will be delighted to host yourself, Tony Black and any other BORO Blogger for a drink of the old vino when I finally get up for a match.

Sense now that the new team are beginning to build up some real momentum for long needed positive change at the club...even saw Keith baring his teeth the other day in what suspiciously looked like a smile!

All the best BORO Comrades!

Robin Mitton
FOOTBALL FOR NATIONS

Posted by: robin mitton  | January 16, 2008 8:38 AM

stockton red wrote...

Like all Boro fans the transfer window is doing my head in.My take on the Downing situation is as follows:

Premiership survival is paramount and we are one point above the drop zone.The club's strategy should be as follows.

1.Sign a goalscorer/ centre forward to ensure survival.

2.Tell Downing that in view of our League position we cannot take risks and he must stay at this moment in time.

3.Hopefully if Alves comes and is a hit and with Mido back on the pitch we will look a lot better propsition and finish respectably .

4.Tell Downing that if he's still of a mind that for whatever reason he wishes to move on the club will allow this to happen in the summer providing we receive the right bid.

Our position is too precarious to take unjustified gambles. We'll get as much for him in the summer as now.

Finally on the issue of contracts please get David Wheater signed up to a long term deal. His contract is up this summer.If he were to leave this would be criminal.

Posted by: stockton red  | January 16, 2008 9:14 AM

Ian Gill wrote...

Stockton Red is right, we are in a relegation battle and we have less points than at the same stage as the last two seasons.

As posted above we have several home matches we should win - Wigan, Derby, Bolton, Reading, Fulham - but they will be coming thinking it is a chance to get points from a team around them.

The crucial thing is to score more goals because that takes the pressure off the defence. Apart from the top teams most are going to let in at least a goal a match, most teams have at least one player who can score a goal out of the blue so it is imperative to score a couple.

We all know (and that includes the Club and the rest of football) that we need a striker or two.

Fred now seems certain to be off to Spurs. That leaves us with Alves and the Motherwell lad as targets. Mido appears to be close to fitness. So there is some light at the end of the tunnel.

If Fred joins Spurs they may well throw in Bent as makeweight in a deal for Downing, Defoe is a London lad and wont move north of the M25. I've got it, a straight swap for Berbatov! Maybe not. He may go to ManU or stay put.

This is all waffle, we need points from both BBurn and Wigan. At this moment in time a draw at Ewood and beating Wigan would do, two wins would be just what the doctor ordered plus a win at Mansfield of course.

Posted by: Ian Gill  | January 16, 2008 10:31 AM

neil wrote...

AV writes: "What is to sort out? He signed a new deal two years ago then his agent began agitating for yet another new improved one almost before the ink was dry. As far as I can see the club are neither dragging their feet nor messing anyone around but quite rightly sticking by a deal that everyone shook hands on."

Spot on AV. I know that the Count has his faults and that many fans have issues in the grievance bank stretching back long into the past, but it amazes me that people take the word of an agent as Gospel and use it as an opportunity to stick the boot in to the club and one of its employees (not criticising TB here but KL got a lot of grief in the past over Veruka, Zenden, Ziege etc).

Personally, I would rather trust the offspring of the unholy coupling of an estate agent and a used car salesman than a football agent.

When reading a quote from an agent, always ask yourself "what would this nice man possibly have to gain from destabilising our club and getting players to move on?".

Posted by: neil  | January 16, 2008 10:43 AM

Vince wrote...

I fully agree with Stockton Red's posting (9.14am) about Stewie Downing. If point 3 happens it would hopefully remove point 4. Gareth Southgate is assembling the basis of a good team that could soon get us back challenging for the european places again. I hope that Stewie realises this and gives it more time to see how it goes here.

I was interested to see that AV mentioned about Downing's agent wanting to renegotiate improved terms on a contract before the ink had barely dried,perhaps this goes someway to explain why he spends so much time trying to fix his client a move, in order to cover up the poor job he did in the last negotiations with the Count?

Posted by: Vince  | January 16, 2008 11:05 AM

Chris Gibson wrote...

Stewart is the best left winger in the premiership bar Ryan Giggs (possibly the only other out and out left winger in the premiership). I know that sounds like a big claim but I challenge anyone to convince me otherwise.

He has a good engine, he has good delivery and scores the odd goal. After watching us against liverpool it was again obvious that he is involved in at least 80 percent of our attacking play.

Wingers are a dying breed and now they need to have so much more to their game. Downing puts in a good ball, maybe not up to the standards of say a Beckham but none the less his delivery is good.

He is a young lad who at times has carried us, he has at times been villified by not only the media but his own fans. I have a feeling he would be missed.

Johnson looks a good prospect however he is just that at the moment. I spend a lot of time in Spain and there is a player for Seville called Diego Capel who is one of the best players I have ever seen, he is a left winger. Believe me he has it all. He would grace any side. He is probably out of our league but with the current ambitous tones flying around, he could be worth a bash.

I sincerely hope Stewie stays and that a new striker will benefit from his service. We are not far away from having a decent starting eleven. If we can put away a few chances and create a fortress at the riverside with the odd gritty result away not safety will be assured and the white band clad Boro can kick on to a top half finish next year.

Posted by: Chris Gibson  | January 16, 2008 11:06 AM

PaulE wrote...

Agree with the blog! 'show pony (Cole)' is spot on.. he'd be better off telling his agent he has a job to do here and just getting on with his footy..

Spurs fan has a point'ish.. Steed may be playing well but a central role is his better position. Bale, hardly kicked a ball in this league.. looks like he has potential but could just be another broken spurs defender..

Posted by: PaulE  | January 16, 2008 12:50 PM

beeline wrote...

As a former Park End lad I'd be more than happy to claim Downing as our own, but I don't think the people of Pallister Park will be quite so keen.

**AV writes: D'oh!

Posted by: beeline  | January 16, 2008 12:58 PM

Chris D wrote...

How do we manage it time and time again??

Once again we have managed to get involved in a transfer deal that is not straightforward. Every other club, (whether one of the top clubs or those at the bottom), seems to announce interest, make an approach, agree terms, sign the player, have him in the team within weeks, even days in some cases – not the Boro!!!

This complication with Alves is just another one to add to the list. At least it's a bit different this time - its usually work permit issues or problems with vaulation that delay things.

Isn't it about time we got someone involved in our transfer deals that knows what they are doing? Once again we run the risk of possibly going through a transfer window period which could fail to produce what hopes had been raised to expect.

Posted by: Chris D  | January 16, 2008 1:20 PM

David Morrison wrote...

re phillip george.

i believe you're living in a dream world and like most southerners geordies and mackams u cant take it when ure team is critisised or an oppinion is expressed.

yes you may have good crowds but london is ten times the size of middlesbrough and your stadium has a higher capacity than ours. as boro fans we dont hide behind the fact that our attendances are poor but that comes with the area that we live and the type of football we have been subjected to.

as for tottenhams realtive success what have you won in the last 10 years? a league cup, the same as us so the clubs are very similar. how many other finals have you been to in the last 10 years? 1 is the answer.

middlesbrough meanwhile have had 5 final appearances including uefa cup final and winning the league cup.

middlesbrough is the most successfull club outside the top four in the last decade and as a so called big club im guessing that must hurt as prestigous a club as spurs.

as for your team well they all want to leave dont they? berbatov wants out, defoe wants to buy a mansion in spain (or was that his missus) robinson is calamity and lennon is as over rated as downing is.

Downing isnt to good for Middlesbrough and never will be so a bid of 12 million we would take whilest sniggering all the way to the bank.

you must have different press down there aswell because at no point has downing said he wants to go to tottenham or any other club. he has mearly said he would like his future sorted one way or the other. u dont work for the star do you?

Posted by: David Morrison  | January 16, 2008 1:20 PM

Werdermouth wrote...

So our January targets are not exactly looking in the bag.

Fred is talking to Spurs, Harry doesn't want to lose Matt Taylor from his squad, McCormack wants to stay at Motherwell until the summer and we still don't know who really owns Alves.

The reality of the January window is that clubs only want to strengthen their squads - which means nobody wants to sell unless a player is either unwanted or out of contract in the summer.

Hopefully we'll bag Alves and get Mido fit and keep Downing.

Though at some point we'll have to shift a central defender or two as I don't think GS can keep Woody, Wheater, Huth, Pogi, Bates and Riggot all happy - it's just a waste of resources.

Maybe we could swap a defender for a keeper - Riggot for Harper ?

Posted by: Werdermouth  | January 16, 2008 1:53 PM

dave wrote...

You can't blame him for wanting to go. Would you be more impressed By Ramos who has won lots of trophies recently or a indecisive inexperience ex team mate

Posted by: dave  | January 16, 2008 2:14 PM

Robbie Fowler wrote...

I think your comments are well founded. Have the knockers forgot how Stewie was stifled by the quiff and the swede at the same time?

Any left winger would have been put off for life in taking full backs on if losing the ball could result in a counter attack when there was no support. They both played him in a holding role rather than give him a free role to take people on and create like we all know he is capable of.

Stick with Boro Stewie, better times are ahead, if you have to go, pick almost any team rather than toffee hearted Spurs.

Posted by: Robbie Fowler  | January 16, 2008 2:21 PM

Never Happy wrote...

Stockton Red - spot on post.

Get Wheater signed up long term and make him Captain next season

Posted by: Never Happy  | January 16, 2008 2:51 PM

Orange Dave wrote...

I believe Stewie's going, if not effectively gone, and not just for football reasons.

The England attention and the money will have shown him a London lifestyle that is quite simply not available in the North East, along with a new challenge, the chance to leave the boo-boys behind (if only temporarily) and the media spotlight of a big money transfer on him, and if he does perform it could guarantee a place with the new England manager.

Whether we should sell is another matter, and if the choice is still in the hands of MFC (which I believe it isn't) then we should be holding out for the silly money as all the quotes have suggested, and the £8 - 10 million figure strikes me as sensible money, not the silly fees expected in the January window.

Stewie is very good, not yet great, but with the paucity of good left wingers, and one of the highest crossing rates in the country, his value should be a fair bit higher.

The potential of Stewie staying and 2 highly rated Brazillian international strikers arriving is a mouthwatering one, although I'd bet Jinky's hoping Stewie will go!

Posted by: Orange Dave  | January 16, 2008 3:02 PM

BLT wrote...

Stewie is proper Boro and he won't be happy at Spuds. He will want to be back on the decks at the Purple Onion on a Saturday night and will miss a parmo.

He will need to be straight on the last plane to Teesside after the match to bring his washing home to his mam.

Posted by: BLT  | January 16, 2008 3:13 PM

andy wrote...

I shed a little emotional tear for Philip George and the fact that his sensibilities may have been offended by the views of some on this board. Thanks for your reality check Phil, now one for you.

-A look at the table suggests you should welcome 'abuse' from the big 11; you after all are a lowly 12th, slightly better than ourselves!

-A minority of fans singled Downing for abuse because he has so much ability and could do better.

-Tepid crowd; I've been to WHL and believe me, you make the Gooners look like Galatasary!

-We are a town of approx. 150,000. Your home turf has millions, admittedly shared amongst many teams and yet you 'fill ALMOST every single league game'. Shame on you; the ground only holds 36,000 or thereabouts.

-Current 'intelligence', suggests a large number of Spurs fans do not want Downing and appear to believe you are worthy of better.

-Message boards are a reasonable, if not a wholly accurate reflection of opinion.

-Dinosaurs once roamed the earth, I once had hair, Spurs once won trophies....point taken?

-MFC are statistically the most successful club outside the big 4 over the past 10 years. Accept it, live with it, turn green with envy; whatever, just face facts.

-"Non league team to win the FA Cup". How old (and dull) are you?

-I live in the South Phil. I know AV's views are, unfortunately, GENERALLY subscibed to.

-Your fans are, in my opinion, second to West Ham in their fickleness.I understand that; they live in the shadow of a superior, more successful, better supported club, rightly eulogised by the media. You lot are the NUFC of London. (We're massive and we won loads years and years and years ago, and we have more fans than you!)-YAWN.

-We reached finals in the very recent past Phil; until you get there dont come on here with your 'Charlie big nuts' claims; you've won nowt yet and until you do, my earlier statement stands.

-You lot have spent shed loads of dosh and now are a massive 3 points clear of us. Aren't you embarrassed that clubs take your money for inferior products? You should contact Trading Standards to see if you have recourse under the Trades Descriptions Act; "my how we laughed"!

-I think you'll find his agent has been doing all the talking Phil. Of course He's flattered by interest from elsewhere, even your lot.

-Dont get bad tempered about Fred. I bet you're still narked that Juninho turned you lot down. We want a prolific Brazillian forward so if you get Fred, go darn' the Seven Sisters and have Shandy on me. He might turn out to be as successful as Bent.

Dont get upset Phil; its only football.

Posted by: andy  | January 16, 2008 3:56 PM

Ian Gill wrote...

Keegan back at Toon, dont know whether to laugh or cry. Ill settle for laughing, it certainly is a brave move by Ashley. Spoke to some colleagues and wouldnt be surprised if it was short term and/or Shearer is involved.

Posted by: Ian Gill  | January 16, 2008 4:44 PM

george zorlakkis wrote...

how are we londons answer to newcastle? weve won something in the past 20 years, we have a player being valued at 30 mill. if downing came to us it would be the same as leaving wycombe for us. that is the gap in size between boro and spurs....numpty

Posted by: george zorlakkis  | January 16, 2008 5:00 PM

james wrote...

Boro are a tiny club.

Spurs are a bigger club.

Downing would not get in a club inside the top 4 immediately no matter how good you think he is. Therefore he will look to further his career at someone such as Spurs (No Left Winger), Man City (Petrov) or Villa (Young) before hopefully getting a step up to an even bigger club (see Carrick -> Spurs -> Man United).

I dont know what you are complaining about mate, you sold Yakubu and bought Mido. Come on. You're clearly run by idiots and if you sell your best players and buy tat, even the most loyal of Teesiders will hop it - and Downing unfortunately fits into that category.

There is more chance of medals at spurs than Boro.

And that is fact.

Posted by: james  | January 16, 2008 5:03 PM

Glenn Cunningham wrote...

Pretty biased view there but I guess we have all been guilty of have blinkers on when it comes to football. Downing is boro’s best player & he has offered the club a lot over the years and for that he should get to look at what is best for his career.

Don’t doubt for a second that Tottenham are a massive side. 5th twice in the past 2 years. This year started of bad but under Ramos are now one of the in form teams. & still in all cups & we all know they will rise in the league & next year it will be back to the norm.

As for fickle fans. Don’t every club have them? instead of boro fans booing him, let someone else do it & who knows if the guy really is quality then surely supplying the ball for the likes of keane, berbs, defoe & bent should make him even better.

Posted by: Glenn Cunningham  | January 16, 2008 5:07 PM

john sully wrote...

I really don't mind if stewy goes. good player but if we need the funds for a fred, alves swoop then then selling him might not be so bad. bring in matt taylor, nurture johnson and have real firepower. i'm all for it

Posted by: john sully  | January 16, 2008 5:55 PM

tonyblack wrote...

It REALLY pains me to say it, but, welcome back Keegan !

My Newcastle fan mate just called me to say that there is a queue twice around St James for tonights game.

I know that you guys will heckle me for saying this, but what I wouldn't give to have this buzz at our ground. I can't see us ever getting this with GS. Sorry, but that's how I see it.

TB

Posted by: tonyblack  | January 16, 2008 6:00 PM

lauren wrote...

Please don't leave!

Posted by: lauren  | January 16, 2008 6:14 PM

Ken wrote...

AV - where should we go to get the news on the Dutch F.A. decision on Alves ?

Will you be reporting it on this blog when it happens?

**AV writes: I think it depends on the complexity of the legal arguments and whether the two clubs are ready to compromise to get it resolved quickly. Hopefully there will be a swift verdict but you never know, this is Boro after all. We'll get it up as soon as we can.

Posted by: Ken  | January 16, 2008 6:16 PM

bradinho wrote...

Its about time we got a petition together to make it known that we want Stewie to STAY !!!

Posted by: bradinho  | January 16, 2008 6:59 PM

stockton red wrote...

Tony Black -a pathetic little jibe even by your standards.

The Geordies revere Keegan for what he did as a player and manager previously.Thats why they are there.

Can you not recall when 23000 turned up at the Riverside for a reserve match to see Juninho return.Basically it was for the same reason.

Lets see if Keegan is a miracle worker at the end of the season.

Posted by: stockton red  | January 16, 2008 7:43 PM

andy wrote...

"Boro are a tiny club, Spurs are a bigger club". Bigger than tiny; very small perhaps?

Great statement showing an intellect the size of our team perhaps. As I said, its only football!

Posted by: andy  | January 16, 2008 8:34 PM

JMc wrote...

From:-

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afonso_Alves

In January 2008, Alves found himself locked in a transfer saga, involving SC Heerenveen and AZ Alkmaar, after signing a contract with the latter side. AZ also claimed to have a formal agreement with Heerenveen. Heerenveen, however, have so far refused to allow the move to take place.[2]

January 16th 2008, after a tribunal was held 16:30GMT with parties AZ Alkmar, The Dutch FA and SC Heerenveen in attendance, an agreement was reached to release Afonso Alves from his contract with AZ Alkmar, thus allowing him to move to England with Middlesbrough being his likely destination.

AV - any confirmation of this yet?

**AV writes: Not yet but I would be very wary of seeing Wikipedia as definitive.

Posted by: JMc  | January 16, 2008 9:50 PM

Ken wrote...

ZEIST - the arbitration committee does not pronounce sentence Wednesday still concerning the arbitration matter between AZ and SC lord peat on the passage of Afonso Alves. ` it has of it all appearance that Alves two have contracts.

That cannot, said to President Vermeulen of the arbitration committee at its provisional judgement. ` Alves have signed a contract at AZ. That is a factor which meeweegt.

Employer lord peat is however faced with an employee who does not want be transferred. They have still an employment contract, thus Vermeulen. Concerning the question if lord peat must cooperate in the transfer the arbitration committee bends himself the coming days.

**AV writes: It's a start...

Posted by: Ken  | January 16, 2008 10:45 PM

Birdie wrote...

This is the most recent I can find on the Alves deal (posted about an hour ago):

http://www.middlesbrough.vitalfootball.co.uk/article.asp?a=96800

Can't find anything on a Stewie Downing deal.....

Posted by: Birdie  | January 17, 2008 12:03 AM

tonyblack wrote...

" stockton red wrote...

Tony Black -a pathetic little jibe even by your standards.

The Geordies revere Keegan for what he did as a player and manager previously.Thats why they are there.

Can you not recall when 23000 turned up at the Riverside for a reserve match to see Juninho return.Basically it was for the same reason.

Lets see if Keegan is a miracle worker at the end of the season. "

I'd truly love to tell you where to go with your stupid remarks. This is a blog for debate and not an " I love everything the boro does " appreciation society.

Keegan will bring a much welcome bit of excitement to the league, especially now that Mourinho has gone. He will also bring a fantastic attacking play of football that I love to watch and can admire even if it is with those down the road.

I personally wish we had that buzz here and hope we sign some big players soon so we get it back again. You may think we already do with GS and that's fine, but I don't. End of.

" The Geordies revere Keegan for what he did as a player and manager previously.Thats why they are there. "

My point exactly, or did you miss it ? We obviously don't feel the same about GS and that's why our ground is so empty most of the time.

TB

Posted by: tonyblack  | January 17, 2008 1:01 AM

Ian Gill wrote...

According to Skysports Alves has two contracts and a final judgement is expected next Wednesday.

Lots of uncertainty and there must be several scenarios. We need someone well versed in the machinations of football to spell them out.

Over to you AV

Posted by: Ian Gill  | January 17, 2008 8:03 AM

Nigel wrote...

Kev 'King of the Barcodes' is back! Well the geordie soap opera continues, they will ride a wave of euphoria for a while then reality will set in, Keegan will bale out and Shearer will be crowned king. Should keep us all entertained for a while longer.

TB - Over the time you have posted on here you have critiscised pretty much everyone associated with Boro now you are having a pop at the fans, are you Diablo Derek in disguise?

So the geordies are excited by the return of king kev so what? Are you suggesting that the way forward for Boro is to appoint Juninho as manager just so we can all get excited for a few days?

I thought your arguement was Boro should appoint a world class coach? Don't tell me you think that is what the geordies have done. Your arguements are alll over the place, anyone would think you just take any opportunity to have a pop.

Posted by: Nigel  | January 17, 2008 9:18 AM

Werdermouth wrote...

I think the ruling by the Dutch FA is a fudge that has been designed to allow AZ to be paid some kind of compensation.

How can a player have 2 active contracts? If this were the case then technically he would be registered to play for 2 clubs.

Since this is not permitted then only the contract where he is actually registered would be active. Otherwise he would be eligible to play for 2 clubs - which is clearly not permitted.

On a further point, if Alves has been legally transfered to AZ then is it still possible for him to be transfered to Boro, since a player is only allowed to be at 2 clubs in a season (or is that just a English rule?)

**AV writes: No, that is a FIFA rule, but they relaxed it for Liverpool to sign Mascherano last season so it is clearly not hard and fast.

Posted by: Werdermouth  | January 17, 2008 9:19 AM

Chris D wrote...

“Everyone interested in Newcastle and every neutral is thrilled and excited at Kevin’s return to Newcastle” - quote I heard on Talk Sport radio this morning.

Why do the barcodes think the "neutrals" are going to be as excited as they are?

I know they had a couple of successful seasons with King Kev, (the sort that seem a long way away for us at the moment- riding high in the Premier League and qualfying for the Champions League), but his record of getting out when the pressure is on would stop a lot of clubs from appointing him, hence his time out of the game recently.

The appointment just seems to me more evidence of how much the barcodes live in the past!!!

There was even a claim this morning that just his presence in the directors box during last nights games was the reason for their resounding victory. Nothing to do, of course, with the fact that year after year we see lower league teams hold a premier league team to a draw at their own ground, then get stuffed away from home in the replay as their minds are more focussed on gaining promotion in the league!

Still I suppose if we can sneak a victory in the up coming "derby" game it will be even more satisfying than it would have been.

Posted by: Chris D  | January 17, 2008 9:53 AM

Never Happy wrote...

Poor Spurs fans getting upset because the truth is posted about their under achieving team.

TB - if its Keegan that floats your boat why not listen to skunk games from your sofa?

Posted by: Never Happy  | January 17, 2008 9:59 AM

Werdermouth wrote...

On the Keegan debacle:

It only goes to show that much of the new money that has entered the premiership is totally devoid of intelligence........

Keegan has long since been a broken man - his main attribute when Newcastle were burning bright was his bubbly unbreakable enthusiasm and energy that would lift players and fans alike.

However, today he always seems to be miserable and seems rather cynical - which since he is man who reflects his emotions onto the team it will only end in tears.

Plus in the modern game it's much harder to motivate the multi-millionaire players with words - especially when it's now a squad game and not being picked produces a petulant response.

Successful clubs have managers who are good coaches with tactical nounce - Keegan will quickly find that the game has moved on and a poorly organised team will be punished.

So I suggest we should start the speculation for the next Mag's manager now - what odds on the Ex then?

Posted by: Werdermouth  | January 17, 2008 10:35 AM

Ian Gill wrote...

Werdermouth

I dont think the Dutch ruling is a fudge at this stage. All it says is that he has two contracts. The fudge will come next week when they decide what to do, this story may have some way to run and I suspect a deal before 31st Jan is not 100% likely.

I think you are right in saying AZ will want some thing out of it and bearing in mind we are told the fee hasnt been decided may make it too rich for the clubs palate.

The club will be looking elsewhere and if they get someone it wouldnt surprise me if they leave the Dutch teams to squabble amongst themselves.

Before then we have the Blackburn game to concentrate on, the window is but an unwelcome distraction as far as gaining points is concerned. At times an entertaining distraction.

On the Keegan issue that is one for the Toon fans, they seem happy enough but I would be a little wary of a manager going back to a previous club especially one that has a history of walking away from jobs.

On a lighter note I was listening to his famous rant against Fergie just before the final matches of the season. I remember the BBC reporter asking Boro fans outside the Riverside if they were going to do Toon a favour and roll over ManU. The broadcastable replies were not in the affirmative.

Posted by: Ian Gill  | January 17, 2008 10:47 AM

Werdermouth wrote...

Ian

Yes I think Boro should avoid getting involved in any compensation wrangles.

I still don't understand that if Heerenveen refused to sign the transfer forms how can the deal with AZ still be active - surely a deal is only a proposed deal until all the paperwork has been finalised. Many a deal has fallen through at the last minute or has been hijacked by another club.

That's why I think the Dutch FA has fudged the issue - either the deal went through or it didn't.

**AV writes: These things are alwasy complicated by the overlap of football regulations and local employment law.


Posted by: Werdermouth  | January 17, 2008 11:10 AM

mark j wrote...

Well done Alves's agent trying to get as many fee's as possible with one player.

AZ are after a piece of the transfer pie now aswell.
Time is running out and a definite plan to sign Fred should be in place now.

I think Keegans return is good for football and let the geordies have their messiah . We have ours JUNINHO.
As for the my club is bigger than your club thing with spurs- really chaps. my dad is bigger than your dad!

Our lack of quality strikers might mean we outplay blackburn but score less goals as they have Bentley ,Santa, Beni Mcarthy and Jason Roberts who are all capable.

Southgate has got us playing well, we just need Dong Gook to pop in 3!

Posted by: mark j  | January 17, 2008 11:21 AM

Ian Gill wrote...

Werdermouth

I think the ruling yesterday was a matter of fact, Alves has two signed contracts, as simple as that. Where to go from here will be the problem. There will almost certainly be a fudge on the way, I guess concocting it accounts for the delay until next Wednesday. I am sure AV is working away to get the definitive non position at this very moment

You never know the premier league might deduct three points for talking to a club, player and his representatives where there is a contract dispute. They could deduct points for being above a London club in the table.

Posted by: Ian Gill  | January 17, 2008 11:44 AM

Werdermouth wrote...

Ian

Given that we've been discussing the semantics of what this all means with the help of AV's experience, you can only imagine the arguments once the the lawyers get their teeth into it - we'll be lucky to sign him by next summer!

Hopefully there aren't any point deductions for spelling the name of a dutch football club incorrectly on the transfer forms.

BTW: I've been a little disappointed that the national press haven't gone down the 'Dutch Auction' or 'Double Dutch' route yet - it's just lazy journalism!

Posted by: Werdermouth  | January 17, 2008 12:09 PM

smoggypaul wrote...

"how are we londons answer to newcastle? weve won something in the past 20 years, we have a player being valued at 30 mill. if downing came to us it would be the same as leaving wycombe for us. that is the gap in size between boro and spurs....numpty"

The size of the gap between your ears!! Oh, and I bet my dads bigger than yours too!! Oh, football's wonderful when it lets you revert to the playground again. Sorry, must go now, I'm milk monitor today!

Posted by: smoggypaul  | January 17, 2008 12:27 PM

Jarkko wrote...

Are there any Boro fans over there in the Netherlands who could translate what AV said: "These things are always complicated by the overlap of football regulations and local employment law." There must be more info on the Dutch papers, etc.

When do the Dutch FA have a new hearing?

By the way Heerenveen's next game is against AZ on Sunday Jan 19th! Is Alves playing then and for whom???


Posted by: Jarkko  | January 17, 2008 1:07 PM

Never Happy wrote...

The latest update I can find on Alves reads:

Provisionally we believe that Alves has a signed a valid contract with AZ," said Vermeulen.

"But one thing is certain; he had not resigned and was still under contract at Heerenveen. It seems he has two contracts."

Vermeulen will now further consider the case but he admits it is complicated by the fact that Alves wants to play for Middlesbrough and not AZ.

"It is normal that a player who signs a contract at a new club wants to be with them, but Afonso Alves does not want to go to AZ."

The case is continuing as the KNVB still have to ultimately decide on Alves' future, with Middlesbrough still hoping he will be unveiled as their record signing after they agreed a four-and-half-year deal with the player.

A final decision is expected next Wednesday.

**AV writes: Having established the facts the Dutch FA must now engineer a compromise that suits all parties.

It looks likely that the move to AZ will be endorsed and Boro will then pay a fee to them on top of matching whatever they agree to pay Heerenveen.

It is easy to see how it could become messy if any one party is not happy with the compromise.


Posted by: Never Happy  | January 17, 2008 1:17 PM

tonyblack wrote...

" TB - Over the time you have posted on here you have critiscised pretty much everyone associated with Boro now you are having a pop at the fans, are you Diablo Derek in disguise? "

TB wrote...

" It REALLY pains me to say it, but, welcome back Keegan !

My Newcastle fan mate just called me to say that there is a queue twice around St James for tonights game.

I know that you guys will heckle me for saying this, but what I wouldn't give to have this buzz at our ground. I can't see us ever getting this with GS. Sorry, but that's how I see it. "

Nigel,

perhaps my writing isn't that good because this is absolutely not what I said or was going on about.

Specifically, where does it say that I wish our fans queued twice around the Boro ground ?

I was referring to the buzz created by the Keegan appointment itself and went on to say that...

" I personally wish we had that buzz here and hope we sign some big players soon so we get it back again. "

Unless I'm very much mistaken the lack of big crowds and atmosphere has been well debated here for a long time. So I really don't see why I should have to put up with such crap.

Never Happy wrote...

" Poor Spurs fans getting upset because the truth is posted about their under achieving team.

TB - if its Keegan that floats your boat why not listen to skunk games from your sofa? "

Unlike people like you I can appreciate great attacking football, regardless of who the other team is. This doesn't mean to say that I support the other team. Keegan, if nothing else will provide this along with some welcome colour from his temperament.

To be honest guys, and I realise that most of you will say good riddance, but I'm sick of having to take crap all the time, especially when you all read what the hell you want into what I say just so that you can have a go.

This blog is about debate and my opinion no matter how ill informed should be challenged but without the usual array of sly digs and abuse that comes all too often.

How can you expect to debate if everyone just agrees with each other? I have had many negative things to say about many things, but I have also had many positive things to say. This includes the academy set up and success rate, the new PR incentives and noises coming from the new PR guru, and the training ground set up e.t.c.

Where performances have been good, as against Liverpool and when we had a great result against Arsenal I was in here praising people all the way.

But then I guess that you guys chose to miss those posts.

Where I have offended AV and others, or forced my opinion on people ( as AV rightly pointed out to me ) I have offered my instant apologies. I really don't know what else you people want, unless you all just want this to become an all out I love the Boro no matter what blog.

You don't have to go to games to be a fan and you shouldn't abuse people for either choosing staying away because they feel that the club take them for granted for too long and are sick of being in relegation fights, or because they simply are skint.

TB

Posted by: tonyblack  | January 17, 2008 2:36 PM

Never Happy wrote...

TB wrote 'Unlike people like you I can appreciate great attacking football, regardless of who the other team is.'

People like me? In my opinion the best PL team to watch are Arsenal. I enjoy watching them play, but would not come on a Boro blog and sing their praises.

However, how do you know that Keegans barcodes are going to play, or be allowed to play the way his previous sides played.

The games moved on since he last managed, his appointment is just another PR stunt by Ashley. Just like his look at me I am one of the boys sat in the crowd wearing my skunk shirt.

Will he undermine Keegan by doing the same? Will Keegan stay if the going gets tough? Will he spit his dummy out ala TB because someone disagrees with his opinion?

I have read your posts both for and against the club, agreed with some, disagreed with others. It is what this blog is about.

I disagreed with your Keegan comments and simply posted saying so.

Posted by: Never Happy  | January 17, 2008 3:42 PM

stockton red wrote...

TB- dont give up posting.We may disagree but it keeps us all going from week to week.

I live in hope that one day you will have an epiphany and find £24 for a match ticket,I think you would enjoy it.

Posted by: stockton red  | January 17, 2008 3:44 PM

tonyblack wrote...

Never Happy Wrote...

" TB - if its Keegan that floats your boat why not listen to skunk games from your sofa? "

Stockton Red Wrote...

" TB- dont give up posting.We may disagree but it keeps us all going from week to week. "

I'm on my period guys !

I just wanted to defend myself against these digs.

Until I feel this club is right back in the community, serving the fans, listening to the fans, making the fans feel like they truly belong, and until Steve Gibson stops bloody talking about when we went bust, that success is simply existing in this league, small town in Europe and all the rest of it, and JUST talks POSITIVELY about the future and his vision of that future, until all of this happens I will not pay to watch games. That's just how I feel.

The club is making some very good noises and is trying to buy some very good players and that's all great. But for me it isn't yet enough a demonstration of the clubs desire and intentions for future success.

Period over !

Now let's end the cycle of boom and bust / Jeckle and Hide football that we have all unfortunately become accustomed to and let's go and play Blackburn like we play aginst the big boys !

COME ON BORO !

TB

Posted by: tonyblack  | January 17, 2008 4:32 PM

mike wrote...

most under-rated player in the country. thinks to much for southerners with mtv/motd attention span. deserves to be playing at highest level. hopefully at boro!

Posted by: mike  | January 17, 2008 7:02 PM

Birdie wrote...

We seem to have moved on from Stewart Downing in this blog, so the latest on the transfer front is:

Alves - waiting end to legal wrangles
Fred - staying at Lyon (according to comments attributed to him and Lyon by the Sporting Life website)
Matt Taylor - signed for Bolton (would be third choice behind Andrew Taylor and Jonathan Grounds here)
Ross McCormack staying put.
Defoe - Aston Villa making moves?

Posted by: Birdie  | January 17, 2008 7:04 PM

Redcar Red wrote...

Birdie you need to add the new shirt choice (all 3) to your list.

Maybe I'm being eternally ungrateful but the collar has no definition and looks like a cheap, big fat lasses blouse. The Harry Potter badge looks even worse than on the current one. God they put a white band back on it and still manage to screw the whole thing up.

What on earth are Errea playing at? They should be ditched immediately or at least told to design a shirt fit for a sporting professional and not a pensioners baggy blouse.

Who on earth from the Boro sanctioned them? I won't be caught dead in any of them let alone vote for one. For goodness sake lets hope they put a collar on quickly or at least reduce the neck opening and lose the girly hem. And please lets bury the badge with this years shirt.

Posted by: Redcar Red  | January 17, 2008 9:41 PM

Tony McGuigan wrote...

Swap Downing for Darren Bent-you know it makes sense!

It's obvious to me but the club always nine times out of ten, never seem to notice the obvious... Tottenham want Downing as they need a winger and he wants to move on, we need a striker with pace, strength, power and the ability to put the ball in the back of the net.

I'm talking about Darren Bent of course and if you throw in a couple of million quid on top I'm sure the deal will go through. If we continue with deals and soap operas like Alves we'll end up missing out on fantastic opportunities like this one. Do the maths!

Tony Mac.

Posted by: Tony McGuigan  | January 17, 2008 11:20 PM

Clive Hurren wrote...

TB - I will defend to the last your right to express your opinions. It's just that I don't agree with many of them!

But like Stockton Red, I really do hope you come to a game soon. Boro need more paying customers, and GS really is trying to play good football, whatever you think of him.

Like many others on here I believe we are only a good striker short of being a very good side. Go on, give it a whirl! You might surprise yourself.

And that good striker is.....? The Alves situation is deeply worrying, especially as Fred seems as if he's staying put. I just hope that Boro have a fall-back position and that we haven't put all our eggs in one very fragile basket. Leroy Lita? Jason Roberts? Ameobi? Marlon King? It's all worryingly quiet on anything other than Fred and Alves.

And finally to our soap opera friends up the road. Sky went into absolute megadrive on the KK appointment yesterday, complete brown-nosed idolatry. Oooh, let's all marvel at NUFC - isn't it absolutely marvellous and exciting and the Geordie fans are ecstatic and over the moon and it's a true homecoming for the Messiah, the Saviour, blah , blah and on and on till I vomited into me pint.

No wonder the Geordies think they're the 8th biggest club in the world. 8th biggest club in the North-East, more like. And glory be- Sky reported massive queues all round the ground - "a complete sell-out" for Stoke.

Funny that, considering the massed ranks of empty seats and the official attendance of 35000. More belly laughs on the way, I guess. Especially KK's defensive tactics.

Posted by: Clive Hurren  | January 17, 2008 11:53 PM

Danny wrote...

I echo the comments of Redcar Red, the new top looks rubbish. Boro did the decent thing and asked the public about the white band and overwhelmingly everyone wanted the return of the white band.

Why the hell didn't they think twice before throwing out the designs they have? Surely the huge vote would have made the 'powers that be' inside MFC aware that the 70s shirt was an icon and should have designed the new shirt around that - including a white fold over collar and white 'V' neck.

Why tinker with the design and have it going onto the sleeves or up the side of the chest? it looks cheap and nasty. You wouldn't see Nike, Adidas or Umbro doing that, why are Boro using Errea? no doubt a cash cow for them both.

Come on, reinvent Bukta and lets get the 1973/74 kit back!!!! Plus the blue/black striped away kit. Proper football kits.

And while i'm clearing my chest - get rid of that ridiculous, stupid looking new badge. If they wanted to show the history behind Boro and not let people think we have only been around since 1986, then just drop the 1986 bit in the old badge - simple solution. Any chance of a poll / vote on the new badge?

Over to you AV.........

Up The Boro.

Posted by: Danny  | January 18, 2008 4:35 AM

eskvalleyred wrote...

James McFadden for £6million...
Are BORO the mystery bidder?

Any thoughts?

**AV writes: Jesus, I hope not.

Posted by: eskvalleyred  | January 18, 2008 7:36 AM

eskvalleyred wrote...

Relax, McFadden HAS signed for BRUM!!

Posted by: eskvalleyred  | January 18, 2008 11:39 AM

Post a comment

(If you haven't left a comment here before, you may need to be approved by the site owner before your comment will appear. Until then, it won't appear on the entry. Thanks for waiting.)

Advertiser