Boro Fans Tough Love For Juninho
WE GOT not one Juninho letter. Not a single desperate plea to bring the newly unemployed Little Fella back to fill the creative void at the heart of his beloved Boro and sprinkle some magic football pixie dust on the Riverside. No tear-stained and emotional missives with important bits underlined , a lot of UPPER CASE STATEMENTS and more exclamation-marks than the EU punctuation mountain!!!!!
Has Teesside's Cult of Juninho finally died out?
The silence may well be significant. Juninho has been one of the most powerful totemic figures in the club's history and personifies the hopes and ambitions of many of those who cast off the shackles of a barren history and dared to dream back in first flush of the Riverside Revolution. He is a cypher for a period when the cynical armour of emotional self-defence forged in decades of under-achivement was briefly cast aside in favour of genuine optimism. There is a juicy PhD thesis in the complex relationships between Boro fans and the Little Fella, one of the warmest, unconditional and longest lasting loves in the modern game.
So to be honest I expected a lot more of a reaction to the news that the golden oldie three time Boro player, now 34 and pictured how he may look these days, had been sacked by Brazilian club Flamengo following a half-time bust-up with his coach last weekend.
The parmo loving Samba Superstar turned barrack room lawyer first refused to be substituted and then launched a stinging attack on his manager in a changing room set to. Clearly a disruptive influence and with an appalling injury record to boot - and available on a free... he's just crying out to be a Boro signing.
I was braced for letters, anguished phone calls, furious spleen venting at evil Steve McClaren who had driven him out and inept Keith Lamb who had failed to immediately jump on a plane to Rio. I expected a co-ordinated high-profile media campaign with on-line petitions on the No10 website, billboard posters pleading "Juninho IV: Bring Him Home" and a sudden rash of little green and yellow lapel ribbons and charity wristbands.
In the past any hint of his prospective availability has sparked a flurry of activity from the militant wing of the once feared TLF with their extremist demands for the diminuative dream weaver to return and recreate the glory days of Boro's relegation and double Wembley heart-break. The wild-eyed idealists spent his years in exile in Madrid insisting he was a Teessider trapped in a small Brazilian body and desperate to get back for a YK Chow and a pint in the Lingfield. A run of two games without a goal under first Bryan Robson then their arch-Nemisis McClaren would spark a flurry of angry letters insisting he could still do a job and solve Boro's creative deficit.
There was even a bandwagon rolling, albeit unconvincingly, for him to be given the hotseat when McClaren left - "or at least a coaching role" - while as late as deadline day last August I took an impassioned phonecall from a zealot who appeared to be advocating that the Little fella should be signed just as a £30,000 a week benchwarming cheerleader because his mere presence on the sidelines warming up would transform the stadium atmosphere and the teams style by something akin to the mystical process of an alchemist turning base metal into goals.
Now, complete silence. Is that a sign of the post-Riverside Boro crowd's maturity and a conscious rejection of that small time mentality that elevates individual hero worship above support for the team? Or is it a sign that the advancing apathy has now enveloped even the most fanatical and personally motivated sections of the supporting spectrum?
You would hope it is maturity. There was a time when Boro were a small outfit suddenly signing massive players - Barmby, Juninho, Ravanelli, Merson Boksic - and some fans sub-consciously shared the national media's jaundiced view that we had been mistakenly elevated above out station and did not really deserve these stars, that they were bigger than the club and that we were privileged to have them on a short term basis. That hampered Boro, left us in awe of big names who did not perform and indulging mercenaries who did not earn or deserve our respect .
But we are beyond that now. We are a rising club who have won things, who are one of the Premiership's senior members, who have appeared in more knockout finals than anyone outside the big four in the past decade, who have played in a European cup final. We now expect every new signing to come with an impeccable pedigree and to meet expectations that have suffered inflation levels that make the Weimar German economy look like a model of prudence.
And we have won things now, achieved tangible results but have lost the naive and sentimental approach that came with the early, hopeful days at the Riverside. Now the events that illuminate our history are finals and European exploits, not star performers who burned brightly for a short spell to make the dark void of failure bearable. The down side is that we are harder hearted and more demanding. We want results not a media splash on signing and a few fancy tricks and with even the best and most consistent performers coming in for stick as soon as performance levels drop there is little room for a idol adored by all and who is beyond criticism.
Juninho arrived as a virtual unknown and had a stuttering first few months when he struggled with the pace and physicality, then just as he found his feet he took a break for Brazilian Olympic duty . Had he arrived now with that package then swiftly swanned off for an international tournament would he have been given the luxury to return in his own time, settle and show his stuff? Or would he have been written off and hounded from the second half of his first game as Fabio Rochemback and Lee Dong Gook have been? I think he would.
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Anthony Vickers
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In his latter years juninho became a disruptive player when not playing. Steve Mac knew he could force him out of the club by not including him in the squad.
My main disappointment was how he was paid off to leave on the quiet with a free transfer and and golden handshake-the same age as viduka now.
At the time he still had 1 or 2 good seasons left in him and was scoring 9 goals from midfield-we have yet to replace him with a goal scoring midfielder. He could still have done a job for us in the uefa cup. In our first season he could have made the difference in the latter stages.
In modern days prices he would now cost £20M+ when we first signed him. That era has long gone. now we go for the more Arca type players
At least the wee fella appeared to put his heart and soul into playing for the club.
(Should I say this???) I rate Rocky. I think he has the talent and the armoury to be brilliant. He's always on the move and he's always looking for passes..yet for some reason he seems incapable of controlling or passing a ball for Boro. And that comes down to committment...to your heart and your soul.
I reckon more than a few folk would prefer to have Juninho back tomorrow (even though he'd be less than brilliant) rather than some fella who couldn't give a toss.
Vic,
Juninho was a great player to watch, and I loved to see him play. Memories of his tussle with Albert when we beat the Skunks 3-1 on the way to our first major final will live with me forever.
But really great players don't get man marked and let the marker win i.e Coca Cola Cup Final against Leicester, when only the week before he singled handedley demolished them on their own park in the leaugue.
He often overworked the ball, inevitably losing out to some defender's out stretched foot at the end of a mazy run that had the north stand on their feet.
But he did some magical stuff, and I thought he and Mendy had an almost telepathic connection (when you could get them both fit at the same time). But he lost a lot of his early pace and zip after a series of bad injuries, and I think that was what took it's toll.
I was one who actually thought McClaren was right to get rid after his third attempt at Boro, even though without doubt he was an integral part of us winning our first trophy.
However McClaren never replaced him with another of the same ilk and quite honestly it was then that we needed him most, even in flashes, to give us a bit of class in midfield.
We have Arca now, who has no pace, but can play the ball, and is relishing his free role, only he plays a little deeper. Couldn't McClaren see that and get TLF to sit in that role back then?
But he's gone, never to return, and at 34 if a club has had to sack him because of his antics, I doubt anyone, even us, will be interested in taking him on.
In the photo you show, I see a sad face of an old man, who doesn't even resemble the fresh faced youngster who joined Robbo's red revolution in 94.
Here is a man who probably knows he never achieved his full potential, never won the things he should have done, and maybe that's what will eat at him for all time.
" Here is a man who probably knows he never achieved his full potential, never won the things he should have done, and maybe that's what will eat at him for all time. "
You mean like woody ? Or is it OK for him to do the same because he's a boro lad ?
I very much doubt that juni will feel this way as you suggest, especially with a world cup winners medal in his pocket.
" In his latter years juninho became a disruptive player when not playing. Steve Mac knew he could force him out of the club by not including him in the squad. "
Well if this is the case then it shows mcclaren for what he really is and it shows that he lacks the man management skills.
Why force people out by throwing them into the reserves ?
Juni was a true man of the boro people. A parmo eating, area loving, people person who loved living around here, had nothing but great things to say about the boro and so for me he should have been shown the door with the respect he so richly deserved.
As a his manager, my preference would have been to call juni into my office, tell him to his face that i no longer needed him and say thank you.
I guess the reason why no one is going on about the little fella is because we have all moved on and his golden era for us is firmly in the past.
He was much loved, despite his disruptive flaws, because he entertained us where it mattered most, on the pitch. Even on an off day you could always bet that he would produce a bit of that old juni magic.
FANTASTIC ! I'm a huge fan and no one will dent my admiration for him.
Arca is good but he's not in the same league as juni in my humble opinion.
TB
whats wrong with bringing juno back? he will be fantastic in public relations. and if his comunity skills dont work we can always use him as a bouncer in mothercare.
less of the jokes, i dont think a relic of boros past has a place in teesside now.
thanks for the memorys but no return for me.
i cant get away with all this stuff about how juninho loved this club more than anybody. he doesnt love it more than me. or you. or gibbo. or any of the rest of the team who could be bothered to turn up on the open topped bus after wembley or stay at the club after we got relegated.
Juno was great player, but he was always an individual in a team. never quite fitted into teams. Teams had to adjust their tactics and ormation to fit him into the team.
TB - it's nothing to do with what Woody, has, has not or may win (and I have my own feelings on Mr Woodgate, but I'll wait for the next appropriate blog from Vic before airing my views) you are comparing apples with pears.
The point, which you obviously missed by a country mile, is that Juninho was a player who had even MORE potential than he was actually able to demonstrate in his career, some of which he showed us, the Teesside public, and we should be thankful that we witnessed even that.
I look forward to telling my grandkids about Juninho as much as my granddad told me about Mannion.
The fact that he won one World Cup medal tells it's own story doesn't it?, he won ONE, when he probably should have 2 or even 3 medals, plus maybe a European Trophy, maybe another League Cup and maybe an FA Cup in his trophy cabinet.
But he didn't, due to the misfortune that beset him with his injuries and the quality of the teams he played in, he just never got to the pinnacle of where a lot of people thought he would get to, a lot of us included.
Remember the stories that he was off to this big club and that big club when we got relegated?? If he loved us that much why didn't he stay?
And where did he go?, Athletico Madrid, the second team in the Spanish capital because the money was better, or to improve himself?? You answer the question.
We can also crow on all day about what McClaren did and did not do when he binned him unceremoniously after his mildly successful 3rd time at Boro, but it's in the past, we can't undo it any more than we can undo his injuries.
This is not heresy that I'm spouting here, it's a statement of opinion based on what I witnessed, with some hard facts.
Juninho will be remembered by all of us with varying degrees of admiration, adoration, and awe whilst he wore the red and white of Middlesbrough.
But quite simply, he never did it at the top.
Juninho was, is and always will be a Boro legend,
to have the Brazilian player of the year and No. 10 come to Boro was beyond our wildest dreams and some of his football was breathtaking.
But now at the age of 34 we know all that has gone and can't be brought back, which is why there hasn't been an outcry to bring him back.
The fact is when he does visit the Riverside in the future as a guest he will get a reception similar to the one given to Mogga, as an acknowledgement of what he did for us and more his commitment to the fans and club, which sets him apart from most other foreign players.
He's a hero, but age has caught up with him as it does with all of us eventually.
Neil, I take your point about Juninho never reaching his potential but that was probably because some idiot jumped on his leg and broke it, not really much Juninho could do about that.
As for what he has won, most pro. footballers can only dream of his medal haul, how many players have a World Cup winners medal?
We all loved the little fella to bits and he was a key player in the most exciting season ever but I think it has blinded us to a few things.
Boro fans insist he was the player of the year that season but if we are honest he wasnt. Zola was ahead of him, and Cantona and probably a few others too. Juninho did some magic things but he also lost the ball too often with dribbles or passes to people not on the same wavelength and because of that he never made the next level.
We all thought when he left it would be to one of the best teams in Europe but it wasn't, it was to a Spsnish side throwing loads of money around to break into the big boys, El Boro. And when he was on the list there only one team wanted him:us.
I think for a lot of people it is like only remembering the good things about a first love.
What's with that photo? I wasn't aware Barry Chuckle had shaved off his tache.
**AV writes: The lads in the office said it was Rob Brydon.
All you lot who are criticising Juninho now make me sick. Have you so quickly forgotten who single-handedly took us to Wembley twice and nearly kept us up when the FA wanted us down, then came back to help win us our first ever cup at Cardiff????
Juninho is the best player ever in a Boro shirt. He was treated very badly by the club. I will never forgive lambie for saying selling Juninho was no different from selling Michael Ricketts. What an insult to a true hero.
All you lot who talk about systems and shapes and it being right to force him out must have had your soul sucked out by McClaren. Do you prefer the boring football that replaced him. Sell Juninho, keep Doriva. Is that what you wanted?
The club SHOULD find a role for Juninho. He should never have left and if we can get him back to maybe coach the kids we should. If he is still fit then get him on. He can't be any slower or unfitter than Sendimback.
Sorry to hijack the thread for a moment. Any truth in the rumour that viduka will announce who he will sign for on 19th june. just after season ticket deadline day. It must be a big ice cream if its taking him that long to finish it.
Call me cynical but have the club asked him to not announce he is leaving until after the deadline?
**AV writes: Top cynicism. I haven't heard that date mentioned officially anywhere, or at all until today. Viduka's contract runs out on June 30. Personally I don't think there will be any decision until then.
Today's development in the Gazette is quotes from Harry Redknapp confirming Portsmouth have made a firm offer to him. He's put it on the pile.
"The club SHOULD find a role for Juninho. He should never have left and if we can get him back to maybe coach the kids we should. If he is still fit then get him on. He can't be any slower or unfitter than Sendimback. "
Get a grip! Juninho is way past it and has no coaching badges. Lets keep him in our memories and savour the times.
SInce juninho left we have reached the UEFA Cup final, reached an FA Cup semi final and had two good seasons in europe. Lets move on !
If you look at juninho record with boro he only had two good seasons! I am grateful tha the played for boro but lets move on, we are a foobtall club and not a charity for ex players to retire to.
Nigel, I agree, I never said he could do anything about his injuries, he was just unfortunate that it happened to such a talent.
Sadly add it all up and I think a lot of us are saying the same thing. Yes he was a geat player for Boro in the three times we had him, he could be very moody and was often a little erratic both on and off the park, he chose money over Boro when we were relegated (yes I know he was worried about the upcoming World Cup, and then he got his leg broke and missed it anyway poor sod).
He never got to his full potential, and there were "better" players in the Premier League at the times he was here, but Boro fans had not seen the like before, so of course they took to him in much the same way that Man City fans initially took to Kinkladze.
But I do think we hang onto the good memories too much, as someone said above, like a first love (and my god I've met some of my first loves!!!)
" The point, which you obviously missed by a country mile, is that Juninho was a player who had even MORE potential than he was actually able to demonstrate in his career, "
Hi,
i'm sorry but i don't agree with this.
For me, as much as i rate Juni, Woody is the better player of the two. Juni stood out more because he was playing here, i really don't think that he would have stood out at Madrid, where as i think a fully fit Woodgate would have.
Woody was at the biggest club on the planet and he could have gone to endless other big clubs, but instead he chose to stay here and be a big fish in a little pond.
Obviously, their loss is our gain and i wouldn't have it any other way as for me when he's not injured he's one of the best defenders around.
But as this is a forum for debate i simply say that the fact that he chose a club that will never play Champions League in his footballing lifetime, will probably not win anything of any note with the team and set up we have, then i think that this shows him to be lacking in ambition and of taking the easy option.
And don't give me the PR about building something special here as these are just luke warm words churned out for the back pages of the Evening Gazette - no offense AV, just my opinion.
If Gibson was wanting to build something serious here then he would have hired a serious manager, a serious second in comand and he would be pumping much larger funds into the acuisition of players, instead of building hotels and golf courses.
Yes, he has pumped in plenty over the years and he has done plenty too, but in this day and age his idea of plenty is sufficient only to just keep you in the premiership. It doesn't allow you to seriously compete for any of the major trophies, of which the Carling Cup is not one.
With endless other clubs being taken over and being pumped full of money then i think that we really will find it harder and harder to compete over the next few years.
TB
TLF has long gone so all we can do is thank him for what he did and move on.
My only quibble was the way his departure was handled with S Mac and MFC airbrushing him out of the squad without giving him a chance.
When we brought in JFH and Veruka he was not given a chance in pre season to play with them, even Greening was given a run during his move to West Brom.
The MFC report on the pre season game at Preston didnt mention he had played never mind the fact he had a rave review from reporters at the match.
At the same time as he was being frozen out we gave a four year contract to Mendi who had to have a break back in Spain over the previous Xmas programme because he couldnt last the pace. And we brought in Romford Ray on a three year deal.
All players have a shelf life and he is now well past his sell by date. One just suspects he could have added something to us in the season he left to join Celtic. If the club thought he couldnt then fair enough but it was badly handled as much was by the regime at the Riverside.
He also had his faults in that everything went through him, the team tended to be built around him, if he was marked out of a game then we were in trouble.
woodgate is made to look better with pogi alongside him, juninho made the team look better alongside him
I don't get the huge downer on Juninho. He was a "dream-maker", frequently (albeit not always) spectacular on the pitch and he filled the fans' heads with joy and hope.
Jesus! What's wrong with that? Isn't it worth keeping as a good memory to set against the dross that Boro fans are forced to watch for much of the time?
Also, it's absurd to criticise him for leaving for Atletico. Atletico had recently won the league in Spain and were the up and coming club (e.g. signing Vieri the same season). But the main reason Juninho left was obvious: not money, but his wish to play in the World Cup for Brazil in 98. Downing's from 'boro but if he'd known he had to move in order to stand a chance of getting in the England squad last year, he might have made a transfer request.
Maybe, overall, there have been players who have contributed more to Boro over a longer period in a more understated way, but why try and do down what was a fantastic experience? Of all the signings in the "Golden Age", it was Juninho who thrilled the fans and put the club on the map as far as fans of other clubs were concerned.
Oh, and if Viduka goes to Portsmouth (is that for glory or extra pie money?), I wonder what kind of warm feeling will be left behind for him? I suspect the only thing to stay warm will be the bench he used to sit on for much of the time.
AV you are not a fan of Juninho are you? I remember you slating him when he played well. And now even years later you are still getting sly digs in.
**AV writes: Juninho was a sublime talent, of that there can be no doubt - but he was not a team player. In taking the ball one man too far and losing it or attempting but failing with an audacious 30 yard flick when an easy ball was on he conceded possession to cheaply and too frequently and invited pressure on the team. That is why coaches became frustrated with him.
Perhaps more importantly I think he had a long-term negative effect on the crowd. He had a huge personal following that could see no wrong in anything he did and who unfairly transferred the blame to other players ("not on the same wavelength") when he made a mistake.
Some of them appeared to become Juninho fans rather than Boro fans and had almost a religious zeal. Myself and Eric Paylor had death threats for criticising him.
In his second spell on loan he was awful - the team actually had a major upturn when Mark Summerbell replaced him - but the Junoistas would not accept that and started creating paranoid conspiracies about why he was not signed permanently after that.
The same conspiracists invented elaborate reasons for his third exit and called McClaren a coward, scared that the player was popular than the boss.
In fact, given the popularity of TLF, engineering his exit was probably one of McClaren's bravest decisions and a massive political gamble. Boro finished 7th that season, a PL highest, but if they had struggled the backlash would have finished him, of that I am convinced.
I was disturbed by some of wilder aspects of the 'cult of personality' that surrounded him and the effect it had on his acolytes objectivity and relationship with the team.
One of the most embarressing things I have seen at a Boro match was 17,000 from a 19,000 crowd just get up and leave en masse after he was substituted on his return from injury in the reserves. It clearly said: "We don't care about the rest of you and we can't be bothered to even respect you and sit here for 20 minutes"
juninho no doubt had the talent. He just reminded me of that small kid on the school field who had bags of skill and was ball greedy and try to take on 10 players. he was by far the most skillfull at school but felt he wanted to win games on his own as he knew he was the most skillful
AV
Agree with a lot of what you said in your response to Tim, I have already posted that the team revolved around him for better and for worse. I am sure we lost Barmby because of him.
Where I disagree in your assessment of his leaving, though like many, I acknowledge you know far more than I ever will about the machinations of the Riverside. My view was looking at the evidence from afar, it was still a shoddy piece of work.
I also think it did for MacMoses anyway. Up until then his spin and attempts at media manipulation were viewed with an element of fun. We then started getting more and more rubbish with lies about Downing and the England squad, dont talk to me about entertainment and the fans need educating etc. The TLF affair made people take more notice.
Wow! AV you've opened a can of worms on this one. When I read your article I thought it was an amusing distraction while we all sit and wait for The Duke to make up his mind.
I'm off on holiday for a week now, if I bump into Mr. Viduka on the beach in Greece I'll text you an exclusive.
Juninho was our "George Best", he is the only player in my 45 years of supporting the Boro who lifted the crowd almost to fever pitch when he attacked the opposition.
From the picture of him the last few years,havent been kind to him, but lets not rubbish the guy.
He deserves better,he was a gifted footballer,and he played for us,he will be one of my Boro heroes forever !
Nigel
I think it will take many weeks of articles to distract us from Verukas decisions.
In the meantime 'Gate is hamstrung'. Oddly our long standing problems elsewhere in the squad wont go away whilst we contemplate our navels. Meanwhile the rest of the premiership are moving in the market.
Enjoy Greece, I hope your accomodation hasnt been taken over by Scousers without tickets.
That photo must've been doctored. What's with that haircut?
A Boro legend who shall always be fondly remembered. Time has moved on and no-one gets any younger, so to express surprise at no clamour for him to return is just an excuse to have a dig at the little fella.
Mind you, i'd rather have him back than Zenden who was atrocious for Liverpool last night.
Thanks for the memories Juninho, but sort your wig out.
Juninho wasn't a team player?We never had a team good enough to play beside him.
To be even quoted as possible player of the year along side Cantona and zola should show just how good he was.
A fantastic player who we have yet to replace.
I personally think he is too old to be brought back as a player but why not a coach? Has anyone asked him if he's got any coaching badges? If he could pass on 10% of his skills to our young midfielders then he would be a fantastic signing.
Juninho was a great player for the Boro once he acclimatised but he should never have returned to the club after his first spell.
Talking of coaching badges, it has been widely reported in the press that Middlesbrough manager Gareth Southgate may have to ask for more time to gain his coaching qualifications because of the newly recommended requirement of being enrolled on the Uefa Pro Licence course before the start of the season.
Will this have any implications on new signings?
I will be surprised if Viduka stays, I think he is just holding out for the club that offers him the most cash.
HE JUMPED SHIP REMEMBER AND ONLY USED THE BORO FOR MONEY.YES HE WAS GOOD AT TIMES BUT SO WERE A LOT OF OTHER PLAYERS WHO REMAINED COMITTED TO THE CAUSE
any news on bring zenden and geremi back? When is mogga coming back as manager? Dean windass is stil playing and could come in and do a job. Hows bruce rioch getting on?
Can we bring in rav as attacking coach. Bring in ripley and hendrie to coach morrison and downing. Get gary hamilton and souness in to coach lee clattermole. Bring alan comfort in to set up an MFC church. Bring in archie stevens to teach the yak to head the ball.
Any other ex players that we can find a role for?
I saw my first Boro match in 1957. I cried my eyes out in 1965, even though I was a 17 year old male with lots of testerone, when we were relegated. I nearly died through the 1986 crisis. I've been to every first team game at the Riverside - even though I live near Leeds nowadays.
When I lie on my death bed thinking back on my interesting life - I won't think about Mr Vickers being the best reporter the Evening Gazette has ever had - albeit he is a clever stirrer - but no more than that.
When I rang the Three Legends to complain about too many one minute silences at the ground - guess what? Mr Vicker wrote an article on that subject the next night. I don't have a lot of time for the guy - short of original ideas if you ask me.
What I will consider is my life, my family and the greatest player I ever saw. I was at Manchester University 1965-68 and say the Busby Babes including George Best. Remember them fondly but Juninho is the best for me.
What I cannot and will not stand for is being ridiculed by Vickers - for having such a heart felt opinion. We all have our own opinions but I've got the track record to be taken seriously and not ridiculed!
Cheap jibes at the those who worship the little fella are pathetic. There are many of us who will always idolise him long after the current playing staff have gone.
So keep printing the derrogative articles Mr Vickers about people like me.
All I know is he was simply the best!
**AV writes: "A clever stirrer?"
AV
I very much enjoyed watching Juninho. In all his times at the club. I thought he always showed commitment and endeavour on the pitch.
You are absolutely right though in what you say. Too much of the play went through him. He did try and beat too many players before laying the ball off. Too many of the crowd idolised him (myself included at times) to the detriment of the rest of the players.
I believe this was one of the reasons Ziege left. I remember him making some excellent runs down the left only to see the ball always going to TLF.
I was bemused when McClaren gave as his reason that he couldn't accomodate a player "in the hole" then promptly signed JFH and Viduka as two out and out strikers who were crying out for somebody to play that role!
What we need now is a player with the skill of TLF but the team ethics of Robbie Mustoe. Arca may fit the bill but I can't see Rochemback achieving that status.
On to Viduka.
If I were GS I would give Viduka a D-Day. The fact that he is stalling tells me he's not really interested in playing for us. He just wants to pick up as much dosh as he can.
I would rather we took our chances with players who are committed to our cause in a way Viduka will never be unless he's angling after another contract/bonus/ international appearance.
I'm happy to concede that WHEN he's interested he's among the best in the Premier League. The same goes for some of the rest of the squad.
For me the gap between the first team players and the reserves is just too big. Most of the first team are comfortable in that there isn't anyone else to take their place. We need to improve the quality of the squad all round. Not enough of our players have a Nemesis in the background!
Regards
Pauline - Middlesbrough
Juno was agreat player who neverfully realised his potential at the Boro (my recollection is that his first choice had been Spurs). Where the club missed out was in failing to bring in quality defenders to complement the teams marvelous attacking skills.
I Know teams need work horses, but come on, Vickers, Flemming, Mustoe, etal, were never natural top league players as committed as they were. Lets just remember the wee man for the sunshine and happinness he brought into our lives on a Saturday afternoon.
Every season its seems we are left waiting for players to re-sign. The longer it goes on, surely the less chance Vids will sign. Ironic really,he had a great second half to the season, but I doubt we could have given him away pre xmas.I do hope he signs but perhaps its time for Gate to re think before all the pre season pessimism sets in.
Ps. Neil(Baku) I think we must have shared some of those first loves.
If only southgate was born brazilian then he would be held in high opinion like juninho. Juninho gave only 2 great seasons for boro but southgate was a better player and more consistent and for longer. But because he was a defender and english he gets less glory than juninho.
Juninho at times is a bit of a trouble causer, this is the case when you look at his career in detail.
I just wish we could move on. What is it with Boro fans and bringing back peopel who have left?Juninho, Zenden, Geremi... every transfer window we get the same rubbish about bring back peopel who didn't want to stay.
Juninho wasnt forced out. If he wanted to stay and fight he would have. He left. Get over it.
If we all want our club to move forward, why an earth are some fans suggesting bringing Juninho back?
Boro through and through? Are some of us forgetting he left us when we were relegated? Juninho was a nearly man. Had the potential to be something special but never really fulfilled it.
Wasn't it right that he suggested Doriva to Mac as well? He hardly has an eye for talent so what kind of role would you expect him to take up at Boro?
Juninho is in the past. He entertained and gave us some memorable moments during his time here (beating Darren Peacock in the air against Newcastle springs to mind) but we have to move on. As has already been said, we're not a retirement home for former Boro heroes.
The Little fella will always have a place in my heart...starting from the through ball to Fjortoft against leeds to his last perfomance in a boro shirt.
But as a club we need to move on and signing someone purely on past performaces will not work. We have tried it several times - and it does not work.
I'm glad we had him , will always remember the tears that he shed and know they were genuine and wish him well in whatever he does next.
But we are an established premiership teamnow with a thriving youth set-up. TLF now is not the way forward
Will we get another summer of transfer discontent?
No decent signings. Keith Lamb excuses will include.
“It is all Viduka’s fault as he kept us hanging about�
“If only we knew earlier we could have changed our transfer targets�
“Negotiations are so complex these days�
I read this morning that Boro had enquired into signing Luke Varney from Crewe, however Varney choose Charlton over Boro as he viewed them as a more ambitious club.
Hopefully this is just paper talk, but the longer Boro allow Viduka to stall on the contract offer, the more likely we are to hear Mr Lamb bleating again.
Never Happy
There are areas of the team that need strengthening whether Viduka stays or goes.
As I posted on the message board, at this rate it is possible we start the season with Dong Goal Less and Euelluseless up front and Mendiandicapped playing right sided midfield.
Meanwhile Gibbo, Lamb and Gate are sitting like the three monkeys - see no signings, hear no phone calls, make no offers. Lovesick ones at that passing the daisy round each other spouting he loves us, he loves us not.
We were told that the accepted wisdom was that we needed to sign good players to keep good players. By saying we are hamstrung because of waiting for Viduka is sending the wrong message to him and to other targets.
Sadly AV's mischevious blog about TLF might come home to roost, at this rate the next Brazilian might indeed be a 34 year old Chuckle brother lookalike because there is chuff all sign of activity elsewhere.
There again Rocky is happy and wants to stay plus Tony Mc, Huth and Riggott may be fit so at least we can say 'it is just like having four new signings'
What a result - Sign Him ON!!!!!! NOW!
'One of the most embarressing things I have seen at a Boro match was 17,000 from a 19,000 crowd just get up and leave en masse after he was substituted on his return from injury in the reserves'
You say this yet look at the facts right there, 17000 people went to a reserve game just to watch him, you would be lucky to get 7 people there to watch rochemback.
Why is it you all feel the need to slag juninho off? I hear you say he didnt fulfil his potential, the guy had injuries that not so many years before he got them, they were classed as career ending injuries on top of that, how many players can you say have actually fulfilled their potential? not many.
At 34, yes maybe he is old for a footballer, but he is only 1 year older than Ryan Giggs, Gary Speed stil does a good job and up until this season Teddy Sheringham was still doing well. Why is it that once you hit 30 your football career is classed as in the later stages, surly players should be judged on how fit they are and how well they play on the pitch, not by age alone.
If it was upto me, I would re-sign Juninho for a 4th time, he would be an ideal impact sub for us, he would help further develop the youngsters like morrison, catermole & johnson, hell i even think he would be the perfect foil for rocky, rocky is a decent player on his day, he just needs someone on his wave length and juninho is that man for me.
Juninho was always at his best running at defenders, looking for a 1-2 from a forward who loves to play with his back to goal, could you imagine if we keep the duke and the way he would link with juninho?
They should both be signed in my opinion, Juninho is 34, a free transfer and stil capable of getting those much needed goals from midfield, Viduka is 31 and still scoring for fun from anywhere. i'll leave you with the thought of who you would rather see next season, Juninho Viduka & the Yak or Euell Dong Gook & the Yak. I know what id prefer!
Good luck Juninho wherever you future lies, I hope you find the club that will love you like we once did.
Never Happy
Spot on with your 25 May 1:36 posting.
Groundhog day - again. Rumour has it that Punxsatawni Pete is going to be our only signing this Summer and will appear every year at 23.59 on 31 August (with a guest spot at the same time on 31 January) to confirm our tradition that, yet again, we have failed to sign anyone or at least anyone we actually targeted and isn't from the last minute barrel-scrapings.
The Varney comments were in quote marks when I read them, so I assume they were actually said. Shocking.
Why is it only Gate and Lamb who seem to struggle to nail signings - Gate "Don't expect anything for a fortnight as they are all on the beach or at internationals". Doesn't seem to be bothering 'Appy 'Arry at Pompey or at least half a dozen other managers.
Yet another pathetic transfer window performance.
"Get a grip! Juninho is way past it and has no coaching badges. Lets keep him in our memories and savour the times.
SInce Juninho left we have reached the UEFA Cup final, reached an FA Cup semi final and had two good seasons in europe. Lets move on !"
Bloody hell, Alf! Are you ill or summat? Have you had a happy pill ? That's the first time I've ever found myself agreeing with you!!
I can't believe that any Boro fans would seriously expect Juninho to offer anything to the team as a player. However, this does not mean that Boro fans do not love him any less. The little fella remains the best Boro player to have kicked a ball at the Riverside and one of the clubs all time greats.
I am sure that he would be welcomed with open arms in the way any hero should if he ever visited Middlesbrough again, but unfortunately his best days as a player at the top level are now a distant memory. Bless him.
The man is a Boro legend, and that's the ideal job description for him: Boro legend. After all, he is easier to understand and has a more pleasant accent than the current occupant of the position, which makes him eminently qualified for the role. (Plus if it's Century paying his wages rather than me or my Sky subscription, so much the better.)
Either him, or a certain other looking-for-work past-his-best creative genius midfielder who played for the Boro not so many years apart from TLF's first two stints...
AV, lovin' your words, not lovin' your taste in Chinese. No thoughts about Downinho Pallista in the England B international?
I for 1 would love to see the little fella back in a boro shirt. But time has passed, take 7 - 8 years off hime id have him back with open arms. a coaching role would be a good idea teach downing the samba style!
anyone who takes swipes at juno are wrong were they not fans of the club when he was here? or did they just have their eyes shut during matches PURE CLASS!
I was just a kid when we had Juninho and loved him to bits, although my cynical side is starting to build, I won't be knocking him for a while yet. But any idea of bringing him back is insane.
Now onto the transfer window - not that Vic's latest entry actually mentioned transfers.
After reading some of the comments I had to check the date because I thought I'd missed a couple of months and the window closed tommorrow.
Get a grip will you. It's only May. The only transfers I can think of off the top of my head are Hargreaves to Man Utd, Distan to Pompey and Bale to Spurs. None of whom were our targets.
To call our transfer window performance pathetic at this stage is... well, pathetic.
Could one possibility for our striking duo next season - Simba with Aliadiere - create a Prem record; a pairing who have never scored a Prem goal between them?
And at a price and wages that would more than secure Vids.
The Championship side that Teesside can afford, eh, Count DracuLamb.
My apologies for mis-naming the Groundhog - of course he's Punxsutawney Phil.
Juninho was BRILLIANT, no doubt about it, and great for the club but is definately past his best now.
I really rate Arca, I think he is going to be a revelation next season. He has settled in to his new position in left midfield and I think he will be our major creative force linking up with Andrew Taylor and Stewie Downing to form the best left side of any team in the Prem.!
In my 40 odd years of watching the BORO i can count but a few that have been more passionate about wearing the red and white than the little fella from Brazil.
I was priviledged to meet him on more than one occasion and his heart was always in the club and his love of TEESSIDE unerring even when that idiot McClaren tried to break him.
My biggest disappointment is not being able to say a final goodbye, little in stature maybe but massive in heart.
Cheers Juninho!
Vic,
I think we need open a new Blog so we can really get into what matters for the forthcoming season i.e. new players.
TLF's gone, never to be forgotten (I Hope) but sadly only ever to return as a guest of the club, so let's move on.
Now you're good at raking up the past, so how about something about our failure every season to actually get the players the club needs.
Has it only been since McClaren and Southgate were in charge that we've failed to get the right shaped pegs for the right shaped holes, so we always seem to start the new season with misfits in at least two areas of the park?
Did Robbo fair any better during his term of office? He certainly made some exciting signings, and set the PL alight with his capture of TLF, Emerson and Rava all those years ago. We were a yo-yo club, but for me one of the most exciting era's ever. But how did he get on in later years with his transfer dealings pre season just before he left the club?
Has it been the change in Gibbo's (and I suppose Lamb's) policies since those heady days 10 or more years ago that has had the effect on successive managers in terms of what funds are actually available. Has Gibbo and the club been forced to tighten their belts a little?
So lets get into this and see what we can learn, lets hear from you on the Boro's transfer cycle over the last say 10 years.
Is it as bad as we think?, or are we just a little more demanding as fans since we won the Carling Cup, you know that "stepping stone to success"?
And who the hell in the club is writing Southgates scripts? For him to come out with his stupid comments about "players being on beaches" and "clubs shutting down" will most definitely endear him to the fans avidly scanning the papers every day to see who we are in for, won't it?
This is a football club Gareth not the fair ground at Redcar, we stay open all year!!!
JP
I go fishing for trout and the biggest truism is that you wont catch trout if your fly isnt in the water.
If we take the words from our glorious leader as published then they can hardly nail down signings by moping around like love sick puppies.
It sounds as if they are waiting for something to happen, hoping Kaka phones up saying he wants to take a pay cut to play at the Riverside because TLF played here.
As you rightly say the other managers and club officials seem to be busy,
If we are beavouring away we see no sign, in fact the impression we are getting is hardly conducive to prompting season ticket sales. We come back to a recurring theme of poor communication.
Elsewhere on this site Phil Tallentire tells us there is no rest for managers and club officials whilst MFC tells us that we are hamstrung waiting for Veruka and that officials jetted off to the far east for a veterans football competition. Is there any joined up thinking at the Riverside?
Gadgie
The problem is that like most season's at Boro our performance in the transfer market will still be pathetic at the end of August.
Why are the players being trollied out one by one to say how good Gate is - apart from the fact that it is another of Mr. Allen's stupidities, that is.
Who is this supposed to convince? Us? Themselves? Players at other clubs? And why (as if we didn't know) do they think they/we need convincing?
Doesn't anyone at Boro think that everyone sees this for what it is?
And in another (pathetic, Gadgie) installment of 'played a good game against us once - so let's buy him' which has served us so well with Rocky (NOT) and in a narrow escape with Douala, there is a rumour that we're after one of the Degens - I presume the winger, but who am I to credit Mr. Mackay with being able to identify the right one!
Give me strength.
I would like the club to tell us about our scouting network. Is there one and what do they do apart from watch football on tv to identify players or recommend players who we have played against or spot players that real madrid are looking to offload
'Why are the players being trollied out one by one to say how good Gate is?'
I think this is prob to do with the rumours that Southgate still doesnt have his qualifications and that we may have to ask for dispensation for him again. So by getting people to say how good a job he is doing may go some way to helping get this.
Who would you all like to see us sign this summer since you all keep going on about the lack of activity. If Viduka does go then we need a forward, Nugent, Kamara and Healy have been linked but I hope we dont go for them, I'd rather see us show some ambition and go for the likes of Defoe, Ashton or Darren Bent to replace him.
I defo dont want to see Alldiare here, he hasnt done it at any club he has been on loan at yet we seem to be keen on him, why? If your getting anyone from Arsenal then go for Flamini. We need a right winger apparently, personally, I like Morrison and Id have him and Johnson fight for the position (even tho johnson is a left footer, I think he could defo do a job on the right) who else is there.
I really would only like to see u buy English players and I think we could get Chris Eagles on loan for the season from Man U, I think that could be a decent signing.
But hey, we are boro fans, we know the drill, how does it go again, I saw my mate's dad who is a carpet fitter doing Southgates house at the minute and he over heard him on the fone to Terry Henry.
Seriously tho, dont expect a lot from us, viduka holds the key to our transfers and by the time he decides, all the best talent will be gone so we will have the traditional panic buy on deadline day.
If Viduka goes, I wouldnt be surprised if that panic buy is Hasselbaink to replace him, well i for one would prefer to see him return than the panic buy that i know will be Alldiare !!
Are eveing gazette people on holiday this week? no new blog for a week and the gazette never went to the printers tonight.
**AV writes: We have had significant problems with a new network. It has coughed and spluttered for a few weeks and problems today it keeled over. The geek A-Team is on the job.
west brom not coming up so surely there's a chance to get gera, he is a wide right player what we have been crying out for, for 5yrs now.
the degin bro's looked ok as homers but could'nt handle it when we went for the throat. that was in europe what chance in the prem.
about the little feller he was good but in the end defenders learnt how to bottle neck him into losing the ball. he was at his best with emmo and rav because they were in his class.
keep fighting them gremlins a.v
Here we go again, patronising the Boro fans and describing them as a single entity - hopefully they've "matured". Change the record man.
For me Juninho always had is weaknesses, even in his first spell. I personally could see them but for many, including many journo's I suspect they could not.
I agree he was greedy, a non-team player, but for all his weaknesses he did have lots of strengths. One strength was to single-handldly (virtually) beat a Henry-less Arsenal team home and away in the semi-final of the Carling Cup, that year. He also went on to play a vital role in the final.
For that he should be eternally appreciated and the Junioettes vindicated. Let's face it, what did Mac achieve without Juninho in the team?
Silly season space filler?
Why ridicule the man with that horrible spoof photo?
Mr Vickers you go too far, he is still in our hearts.
I was about 8 when we signed Juni, Rava and Emerson, but i can always remember what a hero juninho was to me, and weve never had a player since who could make the people in the stadium stand on the edge of their seats, knowing he cud do somthing special.
But he is now 34, maybe have him back as a coach or in the backroom staff. But he plays in a position which doesnt fit in our system, he floats between the strikers and midfield, you have to have a player a polar opposite to him like a makalele.
This summer i would like to see Boro be ambitous, instead of aiming for Championship standard players. Woodgate was a great bit of business.
Even though everyone whines about him, Rochemback is a fantastic player. He didnt adapt for a long time, but he has that extra bit of class. He was the backbone for our comebacks, constantly feeding the frontmen, and unleashing shots the goalkeeper simply cudnt handle.