Season Ticket Prices Unveiled
BORO have frozen their season ticket prices for early bird buyers.
That follows a slight trim last term and three years without price rise. That added to the extra games you get in the Championship - and you will almost certainly be getting them next term too - it represents a decent deal in financial terms. At a few coppers over £16 a game in the North Stand and less than a fiver for kids it is better value for money than many tickets at Hartlepool and Darlington and far cheaper than most of their rivals.
The benefit of buying a season ticket rather than going game by game works out at nine free matches. But of course, it is not just a financial consideration.
The chairman has insisted he remains firmly behind the club and is appealing to the 14,000 plus card carrying loyalists to stick with him. It is a respun version of the "blind faith" request last summer.
But that may not carry much weight among what anacdotal evidence suggest is several thousand waverers. They will be asking themselves both what they have had for their money thsi year and what they can expect next.
This season has been far from entertaining at home. In a disjointed season that has seen a cultural revolution but little sign of an upturn under the new regime only the Newcastle game leaps out as a pulsating spectacle. That shines out among the parade of disappointing draws, dismal defeats and laboured narrow wins over the cannon fodder. At times it has been soul destroying purgatory.
And what awaits next term? More of the same but with a more effective Strachanovite grinding machine? I'm prepared to accept that but many disaffected supporters will not. How many of the current squad will remain? The likelihood is a major cull is looming. And given the still fragile finances what quality of new faces will be brought in over what is shaping up to be another turbulent summer? After recent summers of transfer trauma many may be minded to wait and see before stumping up.
And if they do that the evidence is that most who vow to pick and choose their games choose to not go very often at all.
What incentive is there for the undecided to renew? Not a financial one. A freeze is nice but many would be expecting - maybe naively - at least a token reduction as a sweetner. And not one based on quality. The likelihood is that the few remaining Premier League "quality" players will leave - possibly O'Neil, Wheater and Arca who are all on big money plus Aliadiere, Poggi and Riggott who are out of contract and thelike sof Lita who don't fit the new ethic - and while some may welcome their exit it leaves the boss with a complete rebuilding job on a far smaller budget.
These are tough financial times. The chairman has already painted a vivid picture of the impact of Corus closing on the local economy and on gates while a post election slash and burn of the public sector could be even more damaging. Many threatened by the dark clouds of recession will see the season ticket as a luxury they can't afford.
So it will be a hard sell without real concrete evidence of improvement. That will mean a storming finish to this season that can offer hope for next season.
Thoughts?
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From memory hasn't gone up which is a good thing, and glad to see the u18's stay the same price, they are the core of next generation of support.
For sure though, the entertainment has to improve, along with results.
Looks like next season for promotion though...
Leave aside the prices, it's clear from Gibbo's words that he's tacitly accepted that it's all over for this season too.
After two seasons of slow decline - that Gibbo has now, belatedly, fessed up to - followed by two dreadful seasons getting relegated from the Prem and now failing to get promoted from a very poor league that is an entertainment and quality free zone and given the economic situation in the area, it will be interesting to see how folks react.
On top of that, it's still difficult to discern 'the shape of things to come' for next season at Strachan's Boro.
As you hinted, AV, The concentration must now be on finishing this awful season well - as a basis for the Summer continuation of Strachan’s Red Rebuild Revolution and to carry some form through into next season’s even tougher ask in the last chance saloon before the parachute payment decimates resources even further.
That 'Revolving Door Rebuild' is, likely, going to have to be very extensive, given the situation with a number of players and contracts - let alone what the Boro Boss wants to do.
With so little known about what next season's workforce will look like - except that not many will excite the sort of interest that puts bums on seats in advance - it takes another leap of 'blind faith' to be optimistic about the product they'll produce.
And, frankly, there's not a lot of what Strachan has wrought since he's been in charge to judge that - with another transfer window and a pre-season - that 'he's bound to get it right' as some seem to be suggesting already.
I don't see the overall quality and entertainment value of the division improving - but with the promotions from League One and relegations from The Prem it'll be a tougher ask for Boro to get out of it on promotion.
All that has the feel of a very hard sell, to me.
Can't really argue with the price, but then again I'm never going to be one that has to be convinced. 19 seasons in a row and counting.
I’m in. £370.00 is a fair price for 23 games at almost any level of professional sport these days. I think we will be in a much better position as a team at the start of next season so the goals and points per £ ratio should improve.
How many buy SC will be interesting. There is enough residual support for fans to think why bother with an SC I’ll pick and choose the games I go to. Problem with that is, which games will you choose? Scunthorpe, Barnsley, Doncaster, or Norwich. What’s the difference between any of them? So you end up not going or saying, I’m not paying £25 to watch so and so.
I think the club should be applauded, the vast majority who buy a season card would probably have paid a lot more than is being asked. I think I would have paid £450.00 for a 23 game season. So I think it’s a bargain.
Come on Boro.
I will renew, without thought of the value of my purchase. Much of this year has been painful, and I'm not a masochist, but the club needs the support of its faithful and I count myself as one of them.
The money side of things is, of course, important, but already WGS has done, with Barry Robson, Willo Flood and Chris Killen, some amazingly shrewd business.
Robson was superb again last night and is our best value since Juninho in my opinion. I hope he can get Big Mick to sign up permanently and persuade Wheater (who has a rather frail side to his confidence) that he would benefit by staying as McManus's partner, but, if he does go,
I suspect WGS will drive a reasonable deal and, with football finances everywhere being exposed and challenged, he may well toughen up our squad even as he loses our few remaining "names": that then may give our Academy prospects the kind of example they need to be looking up to, rather than allowing them to think this game is an arrangement whereby mugs like us pay for the self-indulgence and arrogance of people like Mido and Alves.
In a funny sort of way, I will be much happier stumping up my fee to watch the club get some solid roots re-settled in some good honest earth than just to watch occasionally great individual performances from Viduka or Boksic, Tuncay or Yakubu, players whose only really meeting-point with our club was the payroll.
People keep saying you need to spend big to establish yourself back in the big time, but a lot of the big money we have spent produced very little in the way of returns.
Last nights result may be a guide to what next season will bring on the pitch. Some good football but not enough goals and fragility when under pressure.
Bugger, isnt that the story of the last three or four seasons.
The one bonus has been Barry Robson, I wish we had him when we were still in the premiership.
Whether the rebuilding will put bums on seats remains to be seen. On the previous thread Anlov posted about the lack of local players under Strachan, basically it is no different to under Gate.
We have a good academy but it is not going to give us a new team every year. Just look at the Reserves and Academy results. We cannot just expect a crop of top quality kids to come through every year.
Being relegated meant that we lost our stars and the next stage is to lose 'quality' players, aka high earners. Those are the economic facts of life.
It is just a case of supporting the team that is on the pitch. I havent got a season card but will continue attending the same number of matches especially in the Midlands where I live.
There is no magic cure but unless the product served up at home makes it a pleasure to go to the Riverside the fans wont turn up.
To Gateistas and Strachanovites alike, the fare has been abysmal at the Riverside. One didnt get it right and the other is a work in progress. To a large extent that is the end of the debate.
There will be no stars coming in and we look to be short of potential superstars coming through so prgress will be by bringing in and bringing on players who can play good football and want a chance to do well.
In 48+ plus years of actively supporting Boro there have been far worse times than this but it is a difficult dream to sell.
Is the Championship really an 'entertainment and quality free zone'? I know they have certainly been in short supply, but to say they have been non-existent is just plain wrong.
Plus ça change!
The club, under the Gibson stewardship constraints, of late, has made it easier for many to decide about season card purchase or renewal.
On balance, it feels inevitable that SC sales will continue to decline.
Actual match-day attendance will continue to depend almost entirely on how the club performs. And to re-iterate what I and others have known for years, even if some remain stubbornly unable to admit it, THAT will depend first and foremost on the level of financial investment (?) the owner is able and prepared to put into the club.
Everything else is secondary to that. (Although it has to be acknowledged that the local economic environment and employment situation will have an increasing bearing at the individual choice/ability level. And particularly in the present circumstances doesn't it make it all the more bizarre for the Chairman, rather than be expansive in his market-embracement, to dismiss and even alienate sections of the wider region by placing importance-focus on a 5-mile radius population? Stunning, utterly stunning!)
As in political elections, there are always a hard core of died-in-the-wool voters who, irrespective of anything else will vote for their seemingly pre-programmed party. It's hard-wired in to them. Beyond that core however, the floating voters are there to be influenced on the basis of how the incumbent government and the opposition perform.
As things stand, many Boro floating voters will abstain. In a SC renewal sense, this is tantamount to voting against the present regime (because it doesn't offer an attractive enough future prospect). Many will keep the situation under continuous review and in the new term, each weekly by-election will be considered separately on the basis of ongoing performance and whether the "government" is delivering on pledges and expectations.
Whether they make allowances for the big economic climate picture in their deliberations in a renew/ non-renew sense will be influenced by whether they feel they can trust the present regime to deliver and what the recent track record has been like in that regard.
That's why I, personally think the SC sales will drop again. The "blind faith" rhetoric has been exposed to be the essentially empty vessel many of us recognised it to be from the outset.
SG: "I am determined to do all I can, not only to take Middlesbrough back into the Premier League but to continue to punch above our weight, just as we have done for the majority of the past 15 years."
I think this has been confirmed by this blog that we have not been punching above our weight and indicates a continual small town/ small club mindset that annoys the life out of me about this club.
SG: "While the past 12 months have not been the success we all hoped they would be, there is no despondency within the club. In fact, I am convinced we are now ready to bounce back."
Maybe so, but I would not just count the last 12months, possible 36? at least 24 months of failure.
The games I have seen this year have been nothing short of a disgrace to sport and I paid £26 each time for the pleasure. Do the statements from SG and the club this morning want me to buy a SC or go regularly next year....no they don't.
Does the prospect of middling to average scottish league players replacing Gary O'Neil and David Wheater enthuse me...no it doesn't.
Boro will be lucky to sell 8,000 season tickets next season. People have had enough of football and the contradictary rubbish spouted by Gibson and Lamb.
Thanks but no thanks Steve.
This annual sales pitch is becoming a touch repetitive and quite frankly you have to take anything Gibson says these days with a pinch of salt. Too many times he has come out in the recent passed and said things which have then not come to pass. He just lacks credibility in my view.
By the way Steve it hasn't been twelve months it's been three - nearly four - seasons of lacklustre effort, incompetent management and an excuse for football.
This is the only time of the year when the Season Ticket holders are treat with anything like the respect they deserve, after the club have got the money they immediately start about undermining their status without outrageous offers that later have to be withdrawn.
The only good thing about last nights result was that hopefully Gibson and Lamb had to sit through it and whilst they were watching the Boro scrape a draw with a mediocre Championship outfit I hope they had time to reflect on the way they have gone about turning a once highly respected Premiership club into something of a joke.
I will renew. I will always renew. It is not about stars or price it is about pride and identity with my team. I watched Boro in the old third division and I would still be there if we were in the Conference.
I don't understand these faint hearts who look for excuses over price or results or not signing Rooney or the manager's post-match comments/teeth/ginger hair.
If you don't want to go dont go but don't make out there are any forces at work other your own freedom of choice.
For me it was good value for money five years ago and now it is cheaper. What exactly do people want, Gibbo to come round in his roller every Saturday and give them a lift to the match?
BoroPhil
And I wasn't just talking about Boro either. This Championship is a very poor league with a very poor standard of footy on offer.
If you talk to fans of other Championship sides doing a lot better and a lot worse than Boro - leave aside what most commentators say, week in week out - the theme is a very common one.
On my limited experience - and pound for pound - I'd suggest that the fare in League One, particularly around the higher echelons, is better.
OK - maybe 'entertainment and quality free' errs slightly on the side of hyperbole for emphasis but if you added 'very' to your version - 'short supply' - then I think we'd be in agreement - both about Boro and the division in general.
In the non-bylined piece in today's Gazette about Strachan's selection dilemma for Saturday in the absence of the stupidly petulant Rhys Williams, the suggested remedies are remarkably pedestrian - including putting Tayls on the left wing again; an experiment that failed disastrously at Ipswich eaalier this season.
Surely, if the best idea for the remaining games of this season is to prepare for next then why do something that has no future - like playing Tayls in a position he's doomed to fail in. He's barely good enough for his 'proper' position.
If a midfield four has to be stuck with and the slot-filling needed is on the wide left (though it could just as easily be the wide right or the centre) why not give Joe Bennett a run there?
He could well end up with that being his best position anyway - as it has been, very successfully, in the past for Young Eng-er-lund - especially if he fails to muscle up as he would need to to be a long term defender.
But, since Reading are a 4-5-1/4-3-3 side themselves, why don't we make a virtue of necessity and match them up with an attacking 4-3-3 and have a real go?
GON and The Land Crab could play in a narrow midfield three either side of Barry Robson. Up front, Lita could join Mcdonald and Killen. The movement and fluid positioning of the Aussie and Kiwi could be a trial to their defence anyway and Killen needn't always be up the middle - no reason why he can't go wide either side and get him up against the full backs to challenge for raking diagonals.
Not only did Lita get his goal last night but, of course, he notched against his old club, Reading, earlier in the season in the win at the Madejski.
If Strachs can bear it, he could also put our only 4-3-3 specialist - M&S - on the bench too, in case Lita doesn't work out.
At least we'd learn something from either of those options - well, at least something more than 'those who don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it'.
I think next season,could be a success and I think there might be some surprises as to who we bring in. We spent £5m in january just to keep us going,and I dont believe things are as catastrophic as some people are making out,
If we do our homework we can sign some really good players at decent prices or out of contract, next season we wont be the big scalp anymore,and we know teams have risen their game against us this season,trouble was a lot of our players where shell shocked at the physical side of the division.
I wonder if some of these commentators are just like the ones who call into Allie "wasnt at the match but we should have won."
The season tickets are a bargain, we waste money on alot more worse things,
REMEMBER 86 RIP Ayresome Park
Oh for God’s sake, are people really still whinging about the club making offers to people in order to fill the ground up?
Someone on fmttm suggested that the club should make it £50 for 5 tickets for the remaining home games of the season. Of course, we all know what sort of petty, small-minded, selfish reaction that would get from some of our fans who would rather we had an empty ground than a full one, despite the difference it obviously made against Newcastle.
I am a season ticket holder and would happily see the club charge £1 a match for the remaining games if it meant we got a full house.
On a related note, since when did people start making demands from the club before you were willing to support them? Call me old-fashioned, but I thought you were supposed to support YOUR team through thick and thin? Or is it only when we are in the Premiership and signing big-money stars? Stop making excuses and start actually supporting the team you claim to support.
JP,
I actually agree with you that we should play 4-3-3 v Reading, that was my first thought when I was thinking about who could replace Williams. It’s not such a crazy suggestion anyway, didn’t we do that v QPR with Aliadere and Lita behind Killen? My only concern with it would be that McDonald might end up pushed out onto the wing, when he’s obviously far more potent through the middle.
Agree there is no sense playing Taylor left-mid, but if he does decide to play 4-4-2, not sure he has too many other options, aren’t Bennett and Franks both injured? I suppose Marvin could make an unexpected comeback. 4-3-3 for me.
At £370 for an adult[£16 per match] payable over 5 months interest free is not bad and I'll be renewing although numbers are certain to fall.If you are going to attend most games it makes financial sense to have one.I feel better with a season card than I would shelling out £26 on a match by match basis.
That having been said I am astonished at the lack of imagination by the club to try anything new and innovative to try to attract people in.Any other business would. A special value family section, a noisy area,offering a £100 discount if we go up. I'm sure we could all come up with something.
The club have also this year made not a single offer on a match by match basis to try to get people in. In the past weve had friends and family offers, the kids for a quid-now nothing. I dont know who in the club is responsible for marketing but it strikes me they are not earning their wages.
**AV writes: I think they have all but given up because with every offer they get more complaints from furious season ticket holders threatening to wrap in than they put extra bums on seats. It is the death throes of the remnants of the elitist insular culture of the Red Book sell out which imploded on itself.
It seems that SG is at least two seasons behind the times in his reactions, it difficult not to criticise the man who single handedly lead us from extinction and at the risk of being political, he has leanings to a political direction that we seem doomed to return to.
This will have far more effect on the local economy than the poor unfortunates at Corus, the emotive card was played out for a fraction of the job losses and benefit cuts that this area will then face.
The areas largest employers are the public sector, will SG be there to support the wholesale destruction of them or to support their defence? Either way the amount of money that we stand to lose out the areas economy will have major effects on all areas.
As it stands the club look to be able to withstand this, but it will have to face up to dwindling crowds as football will become the same luxury it was back in the dark days of the early Thatcher years.
As the economy recovers then industry will recover as well, the trouble is we dont have "industry" anymore, our biggest employers are locked into the near bankruptcy of central government, local government will need a decade of sustained growth just to survive, nevermind stand still, this effects directly tens of thousands directly employed in the sector and also the amount of money available to local people, benefits, education, health, leisure programmes.
The club is hoping that people choose to lay out significant amounts of money in the hope that things will only get better, to buy in with blind faith, well I think that without a dose of realism then that is a hope too far.
The clubs fortunes mirror very much the last decade, it was a flash in the pan and now its over, yes folks, you have just had your golden decade and when you look around the area then thank god for European money, without it and some window dressing by UK plc we didnt get much did we?
Price cuts and real incentives to get kids in are the only way to get volume through the gates, football is not the cheapest way to get your kicks these days and unless the club embraces the community then Darlingtons sorry empty stadium wont be the only one in the Tees Valley.
It seems pretty well accepted that our chances of promotion this season are over. This could turn out to be a blessing in disguise. GS now has the opportunity to relieve the club of all its dead wood, a Bonfire of the Vanities!
The resulting wages freed up can then be used to build a squad and team for next season. We can use the same formula that the likes of Stoke and Birmingham used so successfully in achieving promotion.
Why are MFC only sending out season ticket application forms to the current 14k+ season ticket holders? Send them out to anyone who has ever had one and people who have had away tickets posted to them - there must be a database of addresses? Another example of short sighted Boro.
Does the Garmin shirt sponsor expire at the end of this season? Could be an opportunity for the Evening Gazette although Skill would have to make it of course.
The best thing we could do during close season is change the badge and remove it's curse!!
uxter
A realistic and stark posting which embraces all that has happened in the "Riverside Revolution" years - the modernization of the club under Gibbo has been undoubtably spectacular.
However what the club is having to do now is adapting to and surviving in a debt ridden economy in both the public, private and "personal" sectors. Not an easy task by any stretch of the imagination.
Innovations are needed to fill the Riverside as much as they can over the coming decade - how about a £2 a game for schools incentive, £2 pensioners pass and £2 job seekers events etc etc I dunno know any bright ideas out there?
I had to chuckle when I read Holgate Enders post, because it pretty much sums up how I feel.
I was 'bitten' in September 1955 when I saw these blokes in red shirts with white V necks, huge shin pads and boots over their ankles draw 1-1 with Fulham. Got my first season ticket in 1965, couldn't afford one every year but from 1988 I've renewed season in season out. What I'm saying is that this has been going on for so long now, it's too late to stop.
I know some posters get offended by people like me, slinging insults like 'foam hand brigade', 'nothing else in their lives' etc etc.
WELL I DON'T CARE!
I will renew, albeit in the North Stand rather than the West Lower as I've run out of mates to sit with. Or, depending on your turn of mind, maybe it's them that's run out.
Anyways, I'll now join son, nephews and grandsons in the north end and save a bit of cash too. £370 quid as far as I'm concerned is a bargain and is the cheapest way to watch the club I've supported since that Saturday afternoon in September 1955 and always will.
What I do find sad is that people like Holgate Ender, me and lots of others are now having to adopt almost a 'seige mentality' against our own fellow Boro fans, because we don't subscribe to their criticise SG, KL, GS etc etc mentality.
We know all the faults, can see all the warts just as they can. It's just that we don't see this as a reason to stop going. All I can say to them is, you make your choice, we'll make ours. Just don't stay away too long.
Mal from Ingleby
I will be renewing for the 24th time. I'm not crazy, I just continue to support my home town team. Yes, I get frustrated with a lot of aspects of Boro. They do treat the fans with some disdain at times, across the board.
I used to run a simple Boro website in the early days of the internet before Boro even had their own site. I was proud of it, but the club tried to close me down.
I queued all night with thousands of others for cup final tickets because my home town club didn’t have the sense to ensure fair and even ticket distribution. Years later, they still hadn’t learned the lessons from the ‘90’s and I didn’t get an official ticket for Eindhoven, but managed to pay a ridiculous price and seen my beloved team in a European final. Boro’s ticket distribution incompetence wasn’t going to stop me being there.
All examples of very good reasons why I should have taken the hint and turned my back on them. But I, and thousands of others, though ever dwindling numbers, still come back for more.
Why? Well, I was taught not to give up. Not to turn my back and look the other way when someone or something you love is going through a bad time. Continue to support, encourage and be there to see things through to better times.
Like the tide, football fortunes ebb to and fro. Boro, are like many clubs fostering ambitions of success. We made it once, why not dream we can do it again? Yes, we are all frustrated by recent events. But like that tide, it will turn, and better times will return.
I’ve witnessed some pretty horrendous eras at Middlesbrough. Truly worse times than these. After over a decade of Premiership football, many cannot see beyond this current bad period as anything other than the worst of times. But I can.
I remember cold dark almost empty wooden stands and the cold harsh unforgiving concrete steps of the Holgate. I remember a succession of poor managers just before the locking of the Ayresome gates. I saw a phoenix rise from those ashes. A cliché I know but I watched proudly as we rose through the divisions.
I saw a proud captain lift our first trophy. And I just know that we will return one day. Maybe not next season and certainly not this season. But we WILL rise again, and I will be there to witness it. Come along for the ride again readers, because just because the one you love is ill, doesn’t give you a reason to give up.
Selling is easy if you have the right product, preferably one that people need, want and ideally desire. It has to offer something, it has to make them feel special or safe or even perhaps more important.
Putting that into the context of MFC Season Card sales allied to the general air of doubt that next season will break the 10K SC mark one has to imagine what is on offer to excite or "believe". I'm not a lover of stats but it is perhaps a clinical way of analysing what exactly is on offer and what the Boro faithful are buying into.
Gordon Strachan's win stats are at 26% (contrasting with 32% at Coventry, 35% at Southampton and of course 67% with the Hoops). Southgate's stands at 29% with the Boro (most of course against Premiership opposition). Maclarens was 39%, Robbo 37% (interestingly he also achieved 37% at Sheff Utd).
Out of devilment I looked up two other Boro old boys Pearson and Laws, Pearson achieves 51% at Leicester while Laws achieved 39% at Scunny and 34% at Wednesday (9% at Burnley). If 29% got Gareth the boot and 9% seems likely to get Brian "Turfed out" then 26% falls well within that range of questionable.
Late 30's seems to buy you an extended stay whilst over 40% has to be regarded as reasonable success but over 50% has to be the objective as a minimum (Chris Hughton stands at 57% this season!).
Now I'm not suggesting Brian Laws should be the next Boro boss and am realistic enough to know that big Nige has done well for himself and why would he swap the Foxes for Boro and besides we all know Strachs is going to get at least another 18 months as is Gibbo's way.
The point in all of this is that the gut feeling amongst target Boro fans and the testimony of empty seats is borne out by the above stats. Only the rose tinted foamees and the bloody minded diehards will follow regardless, the rest (which by summer will possibly be in the majority) need a reason or value for money if you like.
The only way for MFC to boost the sale of Season cards is to go on an impressive end of season run that might capture imagination and instil hope for next season amongst those who want VFM. How that is achieved is going to be difficult given that a 26% win rate has somehow to be transformed into at least double that to make an impact. With 9 games left I doubt it will or can happen.
Its times like these the Marketing Men have their work cut out, again for the benefit of comparison I wonder what Toyota will do to restore their previous impeccable image and I wonder what MFC will do in their respective marketplace?
**AV writes: For me the big problem is not so much season tickets which have a compelling financial case to sell them. The problem is the rest... the match day walk up sale, the 10k who have walked away and would come back given the right circumstances, the part-timers, the first timers... how to get them in becaus ethey are the difference between a moribund club struggling to break even and a thriving one with a bit of a buzz and the potential to expand.
The problem is match day pricing which right now is punative. If you are an ex-season ticket holder who paid £18 for Man U and Arsenal in the Prem last season how can you be persuaded to pay £23 for Norwich or Blackpool as a pick and chooser in the Championship next season? How do the club market themselves to those people so long as the insular season ticket dynamic compels them break all economic logic and raise the price for unsold stock?
They have to break this log jam of not being able to reduce prices in special promotions without legions of bloody-minded season ticket holders being in uproar about being 'insulted.'
Early Bird Special?? They must think we are still asleep.
What exactly have the club (and the team) shown us this season that justifies keeping the prices at their current over-inflated level? There won't even be a big derby to "look forward" to (Leeds don't count).
Also, could they not have given us a couple of weeks after season to let us forget about the dross that we have had to endure this season? April 28th? If we have a decent start next season they'll be expecting us to renew at Christmas on the promise that we'll be watching Premier League football in 20011-12 (which I very much doubt we will be).
Last night we played at Derby County, and the game attracted over 27,000; Derby's average this season is over 29,000, compare that to our attendances this season. This is the club that was relegated from the Premier League with next to no points and finished 18th in the Championship last season.
How do they do it?
Is Derby a massive city with no other clubs within 50 miles? No, it has a population of 235,000 and is not a million miles from Forest, Leicester and even Stoke, Sheffield and the Birmingham teams. The combined population of Middlesbrough, Stockton (no smart comments about Mackems) and Redcar and Cleveland is 470,000. So are they "better" fans than us? I don't think so.
So I thought I'd have a look on their website to see what their prices for next season are, and surprise surprise, their cheapest adult ticket is £100 cheaper than ours.
http://renewal.wearederby.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=11&Itemid=21
And they have some interesting benefits for season ticket holders;
* Free admission for one selected pre-season friendly at Pride Park Stadium
* The first home Carling Cup match regardless at what stage of the competition
* Easy payment options with various ways to help finance the season ticket, including 0% p.a. interest when paying with a Rams Card
* Free season ticket when purchasing a contract mobile phone from club partner mobilephones.net (fans will receive a voucher of a Band 'D' season ticket towards the purchase price towards the purchase price of the 2010/11 season ticket).
* Complimentary children's season tickets for Young Rams Members aged 12 or under with each adult age band season ticket purchased
* Exclusive season ticket holder event open training at Pride Park
* Ticket exchange/rain check games
* Complimentary season ticket holder handbook
* Ticket priority for home and away league and cup matches
* Plus, great discounts on merchandise in shopDCFC and great discounts on DCITC coaching courses and birthday parties
Do we get any tangible benefits? First dibs on a shirt so we can have it 2 days before anybody else - great.
It's not rocket science - I know we have had / are having financial difficulties but think of the benefits of getting 25-30k people in every week; not only the additional revenue from programmes, pies, beer and club shop sales; but the effect of the atmosphere, the so-called 12th man, it sounds corny but it could be worth the extra points we need to go up.
Unfortunately, I have an addiction which means that I will end up succumbing on the 28th April and buying a season ticket - not everybody will - and increasing the prices twice before the start of the season, and then again to pay on the door will not entice those that choose to stay at home in the warm on a Tuesday night rather than watch us lose to Blackpool back to the Riverside any time soon.
To Holgate Ender, Mal from Ingleby, and Kev B..... THANK YOU!
I don't live in the Boro anymore but if I did it would be a no-brainer that I would buy a season ticket, as I am a supporter. Supporters support their team.
Holgate Enders blog brought a smile to my face and I could almost imagine myself standing in the Central at 8pm on a Saturday night listening to the words.
Mark my words, Strachan is going to be the next Jack Charlton for our football club.
UP THE BORO
I really don't know what all this overly analytical fuss is about. It's a season ticket. It's good value. They are our local football team. If you're a fan and you can take advantage of it, buy it.
If you want VFM, go to a store and buy something on sale to make you feel good. Then buy your season ticket.
If you are humming and hawing about it, you really shouldn't even be contemplating going and leave it at that. There's simply no point even discussing it if you're adamant that you see it as a 'product' and you want VFM.
That's really not what footy is all about, despite what people tell you.
Borobob
Lets take it further. Why not Boro have a draw every match and the winner plays for the team in the next game? In fact you can pick your position. Is there any thing else the club can propose?
Ali had a guy on last night on the fans' forum who wasnt even a fan and he agreed with him, he was "boro" not a fan.
Talking of Early Bird Specials - I see O'Neil's wife Donna has posted on Facebook that she is glad Boro keep failing to win as she's looking forward to an early holiday instead of waiting for husband to take part in those pesky play-offs.
So, should we read more into those wayward free kicks and passes from her seemingly compliant husband? Perhaps Strachan may need a rethink on his philosophy that it's better for players to be married.
**AV writes: Complete non-story and I feel sorry for her. She has been made to look disloyal and aloof by the tabloids and will get stick from over sensitive complete strangers over an off-the cuff comment when they will have said far worse things. Which of us didn't indulge in defeatist gallows humour on the way home from Cardiif. I know I did. In fact, Eric wanted to stop at Thomas Cook of the way back so he could flick through brochures for cruises departing on May 3rd.
If she is to criticised for anything it is the text speak, the atrocious grammar and a complete lack of punctuation. OMG. LOL. :(
As if a woman would have anything sensible to say about football.
(Puts on Tin hat and heads for cover)
Donna has become a fan of holidays
Gazza recommends Donna joins the group "shut up"
Gazza has written a comment on Donna's wall
Strach has written a comment on Donna's wall.
Jeremie has missed Donna's wall from six yards out.
Leroy likes this (thumbs up)
**AV writes: Very good.
**AV writes: Complete non-story"
a bit like most of the stuff in the Gazette
**AV writes: Well it was rolling across the face of goal, someone was always going to poke it home.
Richard has become a fan of Neil M
OMGcommaspaceLOLcommaspaceROFLMAO : )FullStop
gt
Frankly, given some of the players we've had over the last three or four seasons, a fat bloke with four pints inside him would put in a better performance.
Is it wrong to suggest a few ways of making going to the game more attractive to those people who aren't stupid enough to blindly pay their £400 a year? Is it wrong to look at what other clubs do to encourage people into the ground? Or shall we sit in our usual Typical Boro Bubble and accept the sliding attendances and vacuous atmosphere?
There appears to be a number of people on here who resent the attitude of season ticket holders towards the occasional offers that the club makes to attract "walk up" support - personally I think that as a season ticket holder I am part of a loyal group of people investing their money (during a time when revenue is low) and their commitment in the club and as such deserve some loyalty in return. I don't think it is just the prices of season tickets that are ridiculous - the whole pricing policy for individual games needs to be reviewed.
I agree with many of the arguments put forward by AV and others regarding the status of the season ticket / red book / season card over the past few seasons, which has been brought about by the rise to success of the club and the subsequent fall.
During the Ayresome days I very rarely had a season ticket, despite going to evey match, a combination of the fact that I didn't need one because it was very rarely full and the cost difference for turning up at the turnstile was nowhere near as punitive as it is these days.
When I started going to the match on my own as a teenager I could afford to go to the match with my pocket money - I'd be surprised if the average 13 year old gets enough pocket money these days to pay for their own ticket 23 times a year.
Whatever the opinions of those of us who do turn up every week with blind faith and spout off about "supporting the club" and "here through through thick and thin"; I'm afraid football has changed. And the thing that has elevated it to it's current status as "entertainment" is the thing that will kill it - money.
Say it quietly on here, but some people don't think that football is the be all and end all, Shankley's life and death; some people consider it as an afternoon out in the fresh air hoping for some entertainment and excitement. If you paid £5 a week to go to the cinema and only saw a good film three or four times a year you would stop going - a ticket to see the Boro is a lot more than £5!
If the club are interested in filling the ground they are going to need more than price freezes and wheeling out Gibbo once a year to trot out his "Keep the Faith" speech. Frankly Faith is one of the few things we have left.
I apologise for the length of this comment but the attitude of MFC towards the fans, and the acceptance of some fans to toe the line makes me really angry.
Bororob:
Yours is a very realistic and level-headed assessment and a welcome acknowledgement of the validity of other people's opinions and what it will take to make frequent and routine attendance at the Riverside an intrinsic component of people's leisure diaries once again.
There are many alternative personal uses for the large sums of personal money that is directed towards football these days. Because the game has been hijacked principally for money- making purposes by most owners, it's been "commoditised". As such, it has to compete with other "commodities" for consumers' money. To do so, it has to offer value for that money and increasingly of late, Boro has failed to do that.
No doubt this is heresy to many of the Red-to-the-core faction. But it's real and factual. No amount of vitriolic abuse that denigrates floating attendees for being "disloyal" by exercising their right of choice can alter the fact that increasing numbers of Boro supporters don't like what's being served up and are refusing to stump up. They're only exercising what choice they have. And they're demonstrating that they are discriminating in their consumer choice.
At least we can be fairly confident that the vast majority won't completely jump ship and high-tail it for Old Trafford. They'll still be there if and when Gibson or any other successive owner decides he /she can afford the costs of competing more successfully and pleasingly at a higher level than at present and he/she designs and implements a match day experience that people who can afford it, consider it again to be pleasant, exciting and decent value for money.
People who pay for pain (and continuing disappointment) is, I believe, a small, rather niche marketplace!
Borobob
HELLO, its a business! If you charged a quid to get in,and had 30,000 there how long do you think the club would last,
All the way down to the Northern league is my bet.
Instead of paying good money to watch the Boro, why dont we just all turn up at Albert Park, wave our trophy virgins flag and sing anti Newcastle songs for a couple of hours. We could pretend that Newcastle fans are on the other side of the park.
All this and it wood cost nothing.
A season ticket to watch Schalke 04 (currently 2nd in the Bundesliga) costs 182 Euros (that's about 165 pounds) for standing and the cheapest seats are 266 Euros (about 240 pounds). Okay, you only get 17 home games, but it still works out a lot cheaper than Boro in the Championship. Football in England is overpriced.
There's a waiting list of thousands to get season tickets. Only a few become available each year.
**AV writes: Football in England IS over-priced and it comes down to wages. For Boro it is a chicken and egg situation. The ticket price can't come down until the club's cost-base comes down and by far the biggest cost is players' wages. The club have been tackling that for the past three years by shipping out high earners - so crowds drop because the team is weaker, results are worse and relegation has made the product less attractive. As crowds drop, revenue falls and the pressure grows for more wage/transfer/job cuts.
People who have season tickets do not wish to watch others getting a better deal than them: that seems fair enough. Meanwhile, all lovers of this club want to see the ground full of fans both now and in the future. Here is a suggestion which may join up these two bits of thinking.
Why don't the club encourage season ticket holders, who have already proved their committment to their club, to bring along potential new customers or to bring back people who have defected?
I have in mind something along these lines: any season ticket holder can sponsor any potential new recruit for, say, one £5 ticket (junior)or one £10 ticket (senior). In exchange for the reduced prices, the club will be able to add the new recruit and their address to the mailing list/database of potential supporters for future marketing. You can only do this once for the same person.
It seems to me that this kind of arrangement would allow those of us who love the club to do something practical to help fill the ground. The understanding would be that SC holders would offer such a discount only to people who might be expected to enjoy the occasion and might learn to love the club enough to repeat the experience. The Club might well enjoy working with the SC holders, trusting them even, which would be a very good thing in itself.
A half-full stadium is currently a problem, but, this way, could be an opportunity!
The red re-revolution has been a bit like the move from a command to a free market economy.
In the early days of the Riverside the season ticket was a bit like party membership where everyone clapped when the leader spoke. No one dare step out of line because without your ticket you couldnt guarantee access to the big games.
The battle against the enemies of the state aka the FA and the rest of the football world was being won as we won a trophy but an element of the proletariat wasnt happy. They didnt get to see the trophy won as party members gave vouchers to their favoured ones.
Then heresy of heresy, some season tickets were more equal than others as Eindhoven loomed and went. In fact some match tickets went to 'friends of the establishment' and party members were on the outside looking in.
Despite the 'education' programme of comrade MacClarenovich the peasants started revolting and suddenly the free market started taking hold.
The proles realised that there was something outside the Riverside and choices could be made. They were allowed a vote and despite new branding the banning of the white band become a focus for dissent.
Rather than clapping in Pavlovian responses they looked at what they were getting for the contributions to party funds and realised that there were other things they could do with their money.
The free market had arrived.
26x £15=£390 should be top notch season cards,with rebate say £350. Other season cards £260,with rebate £220.Top notch on the day £15, others £10.
Football clubs need to get real. This is a fair price for Championship fare and even the Premiership if it come to that. It is typical rip off Britain where we pay over the odds for everything. On the continent Germany for example prices for the Bundesliga are similar to above and they are getting bumper crowds.
Also why are fans being asked to commit before the season is finished? They'll be asking for your money at xmas before long. It is about time the football authorities got together and did something about agents and players salaries which are killing the game.
The trouble is it is free enterprise but surely something can be done to make it a more level playing field? My guess is season card holders down to 10,000 and crowds of 15,000 average.
If the above prices were applied i reckon season cards 17,000 and crowds of 24,000 average. Of course this could be exceeded if the performances improve. Don't forget we were getting full houses a few year ago and the football under Robbo wasn't great.
Neil~wily ol' raccoon
If there were 30,000 like minded souls on Teesside your views would be fine but the reality is that there simply isn't and if MFC don't attract punters in their tens of thousands we become Darlington.
Whilst that may appease some individuals who would revel to be able to claim to have beaten themselves bloody, battered and bruised in their undying love for all things Boro whilst sitting in a huddle in the North Stand or the SE Corner watching a fight to avoid the Conference it will sound the death knell of Boro. The Club has to get real and indulge all those VFM seeking 20,000 because with them is a financial struggle but without them is untenable.
Bororob,
the comparison with Derby is an interesting one but the population data is slightly skewed, Middlesbrough has a population of circa 142,000 and Derby has a population of circa 235,000. That's about a 65% increase on Middlesbrough, if you add 65% onto our average attendances this season you are around the same sort of figures.
Granted including Redcar, Guisborough, Saltburn and Stockton etc. does bump up the Middlesbrough populus figure but if you start including Alfreton, Lichfield, Matlock, Ripley, Heanor etc. etc. then the Rams catchment figures increase significantly also.
All that said I think you made some excellent points that hopefully the club can consider because if they keep on doing the same old thing the same old things will keep happening!
Anyone see Mark Schwarzer need 4 goals to win a european tie and his team pull it off.....AGAIN! Comeback keeper.
AV's reply to Peter Holton AT 12.44PM - it's a good job that the ball didn't come to one of Boro's (non) strikers who have been "leading the line" for most of this season!
As it rolled slowy along the goal-line, some of our chaps would still have managed to hoof it over the bar (maybe managing to lodge the post on the wrong Blog!).
Some interesting suggestions on the blog. I hope people from the club read it.
I do not totally agree with John Powls initial post.Yes the Championship is not a great league ,far from it, but somehow scraping promotion by the back door [hypothetical because it wont happen] and then looking forward to us getting our backsides kicked week after week in the PL hardly would have me jumping up and down in anticipation.
Any of us that have watched football for any length of time know that whilst the last couple of years have been rubbish this is not going to be the situation in perpetuity. Eventually the worm will turn.
The players Strachan brought in before Xmas on loan were not good.However the January seven [perhaps excluding Miller] look good value. Perhaps after all he has a good eye for a player.
There are bound to be more big changes in the summer.Forest changed 10 players last summer for a total cost of £4 million and have improved massively.
Football in England is overpriced everywhere.I could go to Darlo when Boro are not at home and the cost £18 [Yes I'm not kidding]. It actually makes my riverside season card at £16 per match look a steal in comparison.
The bottom line is the product on the pitch.IF Strachan can bring the right players in the summer we can hit the ground running in August and restore a bit of faith,hope and belief in the club.I'd rather not contemplate the alternative.
Or, Bororob and Richard, a man can take his wife to a pub of my acquaintance, have a pint of ale whilst waiting (£2.60) and then both have a fillet steak dinner - and it really is fillet and comes with a dressed salad, chips and a mushroom dish - (£20 for the two), buy a bottle of Rioja or Cabernet Sauvignon (£12.50) and STILL have change from the cost of that man's single West Stand Upper ticket for one Boro match. Which his wife CAN'T go to.
But the man's football expenditure should be increased to include the cost of travel there and back and anything he buys at the ground.
Maybe I'm cheating because it would be an extra £2.50 each for the steak dinner on Fridays, but the point is still made. The meal is very good every time, unlike the football. And two can enjoy it for the price of one football match. And you could watch a match on one of the TV screens at the pub, too (if keen enough).
Is football a game? A chance to support local lads playing for a local team? A traditional way for the working man to spend a Saturday afternoon every fortnight or so? (Or, increasingly, some other day of the week at a time which bears no relation to the ability of supporters to travel to the game but everything to do with the convenience of the TV purseholders?).
Or is it the "entertainment" that has been mentioned? A social event to attend seated, not to make too much noise, to watch players many of whom may have little or no connection or affection for our club or area, save the knowledge that it might (until very recently at least) have afforded a chance to top up the foreign-based hedge or pension fund and a last chance to be paid an obscene amount in the autumn of a career?
In the latter scenario, the seller of an entertainment can't expect the same loyalty as the former. If you pay good money to see a play, but the actors can no longer perform, you'd hardly be expected to go again, would you? If my steak meal was poor I might go again to see if it was just an off night, but I wouldn't go week after week if it remained poor.
You might also expect different standards depending on the amount paid. Paying £750 for an old banger one might be happy if it runs - the passenger seat might be stained, the gears might not be so smooth, there might be odd squeaky noises and the radio doesn't work, but it at least gets you to work and back - and if it gives a year's service. But you'd be very unhappy if your £45K Mercedes performed in the same way.
Or, to look at it another way, if the waiting staff were being paid £20K and the chef £50K A WEEK, and you were paying well for the meal, you wouldn't be happy to get a McDonald's in that restaurant, would you?
So if supporters pay a lot to see a game, if they percieve the people they go to see as being paid a king's ransome and not (regularly) performing, some of them might just conceivably fall out of love with the game. Decide that the commodity is no longer worth the price demanded, or the time spent on it.
We can't criticise people for making their own decisions. They may be short of money, be worried about their job security (in this region especially), or they may have other priorities in life at that specific time. They move away, they might start to have other things to do on a weekend, child minding as a family grows, or looking after aged relatives when not at work, for example.
Very rarely do people do the same things at 50 that they did at 15. How many of us still play football in the street, or play marbles, go to the Youth Club or swimming baths, listen to current "pop music"?
Going to football matches, despite the impression that might be given in the media, is very much a minority interest. And some of the minority might dip in and dip out of that interest. Otherwise, death apart, our ground would have to seat 100,000 as each supporter, once seeing his first game, would continue assiduously attending for life.
It's not like that in football, or in real life. But I'll still be there at the Riverside on Saturday, hoping the "steak" is good this time. It was more tasty last week than it has been for a while, but is still well short of Michelin star status.
It's just the hope that, one day, the fare on offer will make the mouth water and be all you could dream of. And, having eaten that meal, the smitten supporter will live in the hope that another really good meal will come along soon(ish).
We must be mad.
Redcar Red
In simple terms east of the M1 is Forest country, west and it is the Rams so they have a good catchment area.
Where Derby are clever is in their marketing of tickets. Forest fans complain that they 'buy' 6000 fans a week. Untrue but there will be some element of fact.
One of the clever wheezes is that people can buy blocks of tickets at well discounted prices and sell them on. He has to pay up front but he can sell them at a profit and people still get a discounted ticket.
Airlines sell tickets through many channels, there is no reason why the club cant.
Imagine pubs being able to buy blocks of tickets and make a small profit. Punters meet at the pub for a bite and a pint, minibus laid on. Include decent kids prices. It could be an attractive package.
The club gets bums on seats, pub gets some business as does minibus hire and the punters get a decent afternoon out. There are flaws in that it may just be the same fans but it is only an example.
No doubt someone is going to post that it already happens and make me look even dafter. If that is possible.
**AV writes: That pub club/estate/workplace block-booking discount is a very interetsing idea.
a season ticket holder said to me last night that what he really wanted was the chance to take his son and maybe some of his boy's friends, not every game but maybe five or six times a season. He wants the club to give him the option of buying occasional blocks of kids tickets at the £5 price and the possibility of switching toa more family orienatated area just for those game.
People do want to go but on their own (often complex) terms and the club need to be adventurous and flexible to meet the demands of the market.
Off topic but are celtic missing Strachan? Interview with Barry Robson
BARRY ROBSON believes Tony Mowbray was determined to rip up Gordon Strachan's Celtic side - and has tipped Aiden McGeady to be the next big name to leave.
He spoke exclusively to Record Sport as his old club prepare for a 10-game push to save Mowbray's title hopes.
Two years ago Robson was hailed as the driving force behind Strachan's astonishing comeback when the Parkhead men rattled off seven straight league wins to clinch the title on the last day of the season.
But the Scotland player was part of Mowbray's first season clear-out when he left for Middlesbrough in January and now wonders whether or not the new men in Celtic's dressing room have it in them to mount a similar late run.
Robson admits he knew his time was up as soon as Mowbray set about dismantling Strachan's three-time title-winning squad.
And he fears star man McGeady may have already made the same decision to get out when the next transfer window opens.
Robson said: "It was evident to me that Tony wanted to do his own thing. He wanted to break up Gordon's team and build one of his own. It was pretty obvious but that's fair enough. That's his prerogative.
"I look back on the start of this season as an end of an era. Naka had left, Big Jan had gone and then the likes of Gary Caldwell and Big Mick moved on in January. I knew myself it was time for me to move on too.
"There's a good chance that Aiden will leave in the summer as well because he wants to try something different so it will be completely Tony's team soon. And it was obvious to me that was the way he wanted it."
Robson now suspects those Celtic fans who wanted rid of Strachan a year ago might have had a change of heart throughout Mowbray's first turbulent season.
He added: "I think, if we're being honest, the Celtic fans will be missing him too now because what he achieved in his time at the club was brilliant."
Some excellent comments on here.
Bororob's Derby-based research is illuminating, and shows what the club is missing out on. AV is correct in saying that any offer to non season ticket holders is immediately renounced as unfair and the source of all evil - but would those with a season ticket be so bothered if they were getting other tangible benefits?
The issue with a lot of the "extras" offered by Derby though, is what is their additional value? First choice on home and away league games? We haven't sold out once this season, so you don't really need "first choice", certainly for home games, although the away support has been strong.
I used to be a season ticket holder until I left the country. I guess the key thing to say is this - if I moved back now, would I get a season ticket? Probably not. The quality of the football hasn't been great, some of the opposition are not great, and it confers no extra advantage to me than to pick and choose the games I want to see, and am actually available to see.
BUT - as someone who has been a season ticket holder and a non-season ticket holder, I cannot understand why season ticket holders moan whenever the club try to put a deal on for the other fans.
Presumably you didn't buy your ticket because it's a great deal, but because you support the club and want to show that support. So what's wrong with the club trying to fill that empty seat behind/in front/ to the side of you? If those seats are filled with someone who'll join in the songs, contribute to the atmosphere, inspire the team - then we all win in the end?
How do we move on from here? The club need to realise that they've put the fans through a lot of change, and tested their loyalty to the limit. It's time to really and seriously re-think the ticketing strategy, and do some proper analysis into the revenue scenarios concerning season tickets and everything else.
Unfortunately, I sometimes wonder whether the club are doing back of the fag-packet economics rather than something a litle more savvy.
Massive congratulations to Fulham. No, not for beating Juve and getting to the quarter finals of the Europa Cup although that is a great achievement in itself but for their Chairman keeping his eye on the ball all the time and not being distracted by dreams of a hotels and golf courses.
Remember, Fulham nearly had nowhere to a play a few years ago, they still have a ramshackled ground with low support for a Premiership team. However, the Chairman used his business acumin when it came to appointing a manager with vast experience and respect in the game. Result - secure Premiership status and a great run in the Europa Cup. Contrast that to Middlesbrough's chairman and you see why the Boro are where they are now!
As its Sports Relief and they are talking of wearing the shirt of shame to raise funds my mind turned to which club I dislike the most.
Tricky because I dont really hate many clubs. Toon and the Mackems are the obvious candidates because they are local teams but I dont really hate them.
What about ManU, Chelsea, Liverpool and Arsenal? Out of those I tend to have a least want to win preference list. The arch enemies would be Liverpool because it is always someone elses fault - we climbed over the turnstiles at Athens because UEFA didnt give us enough tickets. Throw in the poaching of players and Rick Parry's part in the three points and they provide compelling competition.
There are the Scots, Welsh and Irish on the basis that I will give them all the support they give us. Fair minded or what. Then of course there is Leeds Utd, dirty b******s.
The French?
Probably the easiest solution is just take my shirt off to reveal my beer belly and pretend I'm a geordie.
Oops, the ladies have left the building!
It's nice to be wanted again Gibbo, just like 1994, when you started from scratch, you needed the fans cash to launch the club into the mega bucks earning Premier league, where the Sky TV money helped it to fly high and proud for the majority of the past 15 years. It seems we are needed again for a relaunch
We once had a waiting list of 7.000 willing to back you. Now we have 14.000 and probably less next season. If you don't do something about it, or at least instigate some sort of inquiry, as to how we have arrived at this sorry state.
I would suggest that you take a leaf out of Niall Quinns book. When he was faced with similar problems he got on the radio, into the local press etc and offered to meet disgruntled fans, wherever they were gathered, albeit in their local pubs or clubs or meeting places, and listen to their grievances,.
If you can't bring yourself to do it, ask your local press to arrange it, but something along these lines is desperately needed, if only to bring you back down to earth, from where you can re launch this ailing club.
P.S. hi to Davey Connor.
In the wake of the Southgate denial about Nani (I have to say that I'd have turned him down - for Boro - too. We'd have had no idea what to do with him or Sralex's nous in handling his ego/talent balance) there's a piece in today's Scottish papers which quotes Mark Proctor about his role in recommending young winger Halliday to Boro.
Also in the article is Proctor's confirmation that he also recommended Graham Dorrans to Boro who then 'dragged their feet'. Proctor then spoke to The Baggies. Ho hum.
Remember my 5 match unbeaten run starting at Derby that was critical to our play off chances, well the prediction has morphed into a 6 match unbeaten run of matches which are:
READ(H)
PRES(H)
WATF(A)
CPAL(H)
PLYM(A)
SHEFFWEDS(H)
Win all these and we're in
:)
Rob, regarding your comments about Fulham.
They would not be anywhere near where they are without Mohamed Fayed pumping his own wealth into the club. In 2009 Fulham were almost £200m in debt, most of that though is owed to Mr Fayed.
Now I'm pretty sure Mr Fayed is making his money through placing his attentions elsewhere, so that he can afford to actually finance what is going on at Fulham.
Our own chairman, who has been using his own personaly fortune to boost the Boro coffers, no longer has the ability to do that without boosting his own fortunes.
So why is it that building a golfcourse so that he can earn more money and in turn provide more finances to MFC a bad thing?
He lived the dream before and we were in Europe 2 years in a row and went all the way to the final. It cost him, and us, serious money and left us in an unmanageable situation, for which we are now suffering.
Fulham may have appointed a very experienced manager and that may well have helped us go through the tough times but don't think it would have affected our finances. It's all ifs and buts and what might have been had Gibson appointed somebody else, but the golfcourse and hotel would have happened anyway. It's also financed by Gibson & O'Neil holdings and is designed for the benefit of MFC. What's so wrong about that?
I can only look at this problem from my perspective and that is that I only go to a few games a season. The last game I went to was the Blackpool home game and it put me off, it still lurks in the back of my mind what a load of rubbish that game was. Then waiting 30mins trying to get out I realised I must have been stupid, I paid £26 for the dis-pleasure.
SC holders would say that if I had bought a SC then I would save money, not if I only get to a few games a year. Now if I'm offered a deal from the club to buy a ticket on the day, why do some SC holders take grieveance with that? This attitude has to stop.= for the greater good.
The attitude of the club also has to change, in that they are missing marketing tricks left, right and centre and have been doing so since the 95/96 season. The club still have a small town/club mentality that needs breaking if we are to progress.
Whoever thought up the Lee Dong Gook farce was 10yrs out of date.
I can only look at this problem from my perspective and that is that I only go to a few games a season. The last game I went to was the Blackpool home game and it put me off, it still lurks in the back of my mind what a load of rubbish that game was. Then waiting 30mins trying to get out I realised I must have been stupid, I paid £26 for the dis-pleasure.
SC holders would say that if I had bought a SC then I would save money, not if I only get to a few games a year. Now if I'm offered a deal from the club to buy a ticket on the day, why do some SC holders take grieveance with that? This attitude has to stop.= for the greater good.
The attitude of the club also has to change, in that they are missing marketing tricks left, right and centre and have been doing so since the 95/96 season. The club still have a small town/club mentality that needs breaking if we are to progress.
Whoever thought up the Lee Dong Gook farce was 10yrs out of date.
Re Forever Dormo.
I quite agree. Our predicament was best summed up by Lewis Carroll..
'In THAT direction,' the Cat said, waving its right paw round, 'lives a Hatter: and in THAT direction,' waving the other paw, 'lives a March Hare. Visit either you like: they're both mad.'
'But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
'Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: 'we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
'How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
'You must be,' said the Cat, 'or you wouldn't have come here.'
I am not a season ticket holder, I havent been since McClaren's second season, largely because my circumstances changed but also it was because I didnt need to be anymore.
Up until the latter part of Robbos promotion season I had never needed to be a season ticket holder, then me and my son were forced out of Ayresomes east stand by the full houses and end of season ticket offer that made the last few home games a lock out, so yeah that first season at the Riverside we got season tickets. So one match I was sitting there watching the dullest game since the one before and thought, "I could have been at the garden centre with our lass"!
Now I hate bloody garden centres, so I ditched the season ticket and just go as and when I feel like it. Nope I am not a fanatic, been going on and off since Jacks days, but last season I didnt go at all.
The club still have the mindset of that first flush of the Riverside, but apart from the Red Faction there are a hell of a lot of us who do need more than the blind faith to come along, we still support, read the Gazette every day, still defend the club, but surely it must be better all round to have more bums on seats, 30,000 paying slightly less has to be better than 15,000 paying slightly more?
The Derby incentives are hardly revolutionary, but they would make a huge impact in how the floaters would view the club, I really do think Boro are alone in routinely ignoring the fans and making any business concessions to raise their own game and gate receipts.
My dislike of the CE is based on this very situation, he drives the football club and it is his stewardship that doesn't exhibit any of the professionalism or marketing nouse that is required to allow the club to prosper
In these terms the club is very much a lower league affair, everything is run like a "for profit" care home, things cut to the bone that really shouldnt be, demoralised staff, paper thin public relations that barely hide a disturbing truth.
Getting the football right will only ever paper over these cracks. This is what happened 15 years ago and why the club hasnt really progressed, until the boardroom arrogance is sorted out the club wont move forward and in this climate that means we are now in reverse, other teams like Deby will quite rightly take our place.
Re Rob
I was very pleased for Fulham - lovely old ground, pleasant knowledgeable fans, decent friendly boozers. And always the chance of a point or three. (In theory anyway..)
I can't bring myself to comment on the chairman except to say he's closer to the Chelski chair in type than to our own Dear Leader.
But Roy Hodgson was perceived to be on appointment in the Boro's Venables' mode - a last gasp throw of the dice to stave off relegation after the disastrous Lawrie Sanchez regime. It was not a universally welcomed appointment (until the end of the season) and wasn't expected to last beyond that.
Sanchez himself was appointed after the widely popular Mowgli was booted out because middling top tier finishes were not considered good enough..
Fulham has achieved success despite the chairman rather than because of him. A chairman who would willingly sell the ground in a Sam Hammam stylee given half a chance.
I seem to remember taking up a ticket offer for the last 7 games of Robbos first season. I was only ten years old and it was 21 quid for the last 7 games - 3 quid a game!!!!
Because of this me and my dad got added to the season ticket mailing list and subsequently got a season ticket the following season.
Anyone remember this offer - and whether anyone complained about it back then?
One of the incentives offered by Newcastle a couple of years ago was to sign up for three years, at 2007-08 prices, paying by direct debit at 0% interest. I took up this offer and have found it works a treat. You only pay 10 months of the year (no Dec/Jan payments) and it takes away the annual 'lumper'.
I must admit it's a nice feeling when the re-newal package drops through the letterbox with a note stating that no further action required for next season!
Is it just Boronoia or has the talk sport reaction to a great win for Fulham been just a tad more than any praise they gave to Boro back in the day?
Prize tool Adrian Durham went as far as to say that the Fulham result was possibly the best ever for a British side in Europe. I'm not daft enough to not realise that he is trying to raise debate, but when a caller pulled him up on not even mentioning Boro's efforts he more or less said it was only against Basle and Steaua so it didn't really matter, making out that Juve were still this massive super power.
I know I shouldn't bite, but I just needed to get it off my chest. That Steaua side would probably have been more than a match for the current Juve side.
Liverpool's Dirk Kuyt has admitted to employing an "orthomanual therapist" to hit him twice a year with a mallet in order to knock out the lumps and bumps he picks up over the season.
Can I offer my services to the permacrocks at Rockliffe?
Totally agree Billy in Berks, and lets not forget the Steaua game was a semi final and not a Round of 16 match, and we didn't play against 10 men for the whole match.
We wouldn't expect anything different though, would we?
"Is it just Boronoia or has the talk sport reaction to a great win for Fulham been just a tad more than any praise they gave to Boro back in the day? "
Its Boronoia and its all too typical amongst Boro fans. The small town mentality, inferiority complex and chips on shoulders comments that are aimed at Boro fans are sadly true.
The thing is, Billy in Berks post generally just sums the modern day Boro fans up. His desperate need to feel that Boro's achievement was better than Fulham's is pathetic.
Colin Bolin:
I think you've missed the main point of Billy in Berk's post, mate!
You could get a place in Boro's front line with accuracy like that!
"Colin Bolin:
I think you've missed the main point of Billy in Berk's post, mate!"
The thing is though Dicky, is that I haven't missed the point of it at all but you cant or wont see it because like Adrian Durham you are a prize tool.
Dear, dear, Colin. Thanks for explaining the point of my post to me, I can't imagine what the point was that I was trying to make, so thanks for that. And thanks for pigeon-holing me as a modern day Boro fan, those last thirty years, plus, have just flown by.
On closer inspection, I did say that it was a great win by Fulham. Just for the record, I wasn't trying to claim that our achievement was any better than Fulham's, I was simply stating that our achievements didn't (and still don't) receive the recognition that they deserved. I wear my chips with pride. Please say hello to Adrian for me at your next family reunion. Night, x.